lt. scott rossmiller, wcso - deposition transcript (federal)

Scott Rossmiller, March 11, 2014Paul Murphy v. Whatcom County

3206 Wetmore Avenue, Suite 12 - Everett, Washington 98201BMA Court Reporters, (425) 252.7277

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7 UNITED STATES OF DISTRICT COURT

8 WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT SEATTLE

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10 PAUL MURPHY, together with his ) marital community, )

11 Plaintiffs, ) )

12 vs. ) NO. 2:13-CV-00727 )

13 WHATCOM COUNTY, WASHINGTON, a ) government entity; WHATCOM COUNTY )

14 SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT; WILLIAM J. ) ELFO, together with his marital )

15 community, ) Defendants. )

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17 DEPOSITION UPON ORAL EXAMINATION OF

18 SCOTT ROSSMILLER

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20 9:05AM - 10:30AM March 11th, 2014

21 Whatcom County Courthouse 311 Grand Avenue

22 Bellingham, Washington 98225

23 Reported by Kristen M. Uhlig

24 Certified Court Reporter, CCR, CSR Washington CCR #1934

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1 A P P E A R A N C E S

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3 FOR THE PLAINTIFFS:Robert Butler & Emily Beschen

4 Law Offices of Robert Butler103 East Holly Street Suite 512

5 Bellingham, Washington 98225360.734.3448

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7 FOR THE DEFENDANTS WHATCOM COUNTY & SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT & ELFODale Kamerrer

8 Law Lyman Daniel Kamerrer Bogdanovich2674 RW Johnson Blvd SW

9 Tumwater, Washington 98512360.754.3480

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11 FOR WHATCOM COUNTY:Elizabeth Gallery

12 Whatcom County Prosecutor's Office311 Grand Avenue

13 Bellingham, Washington 98225

14ALSO PRESENT:

15 William ElfoTara Adrian-Stavik

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1 I N D E X

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3 EXAMINATION: PAGE

4 BY MR. BUTLER.................................................4

5 BY MR. KAMERRER..............................................51

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8 EXHIBIT DESCRIPTION PAGE

9 16....E-mail from McFadden, Dated 3/8/2008 - Murphy Memo.....23

10 17....E-mail from Murphy, Dated 12/31/2011 - GIG Notes.......25 With Attachments

11 18....Whatcom County Sheriff's Office Memo - 2/9/2012........31 Subject: Deputy Paul Murphy

12 19....Whatcom County Sheriff's Office Memo - 2/14/2012.......34 Subject: Mobile Computer

13 20....E-mail from Rossmiller, Dated 2/21/2012 - Memo.........36

14 21....2/10/12 - Questions and Answers........................42

15 22....E-mail from Murphy, Dated 6/27/2012....................47 RE: Equipment Turn-in and Property Return

16 23....E-mail from Rossmiller, Dated 6/28/2012................48 RE: Equipment Turn-in and Property Return

17 24....E-mail from Murphy, Dated 7/3/2012 - Password..........49

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1 SCOTT ROSSMILLER,

2 having been first duly sworn, was called as a witness herein and

3 was examined and testified as follows:

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5 DIRECT EXAMINATION

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7 BY MR. BUTLER:

8 Q Good morning, would you please state your name and spell it for

9 the record?

10 A Scott Rossmiller. The last name is R-O-S-S-M-I-L-L-E-R.

11 Q What's your employment?

12 A Lieutenant with the Whatcom County Sheriff's Office.

13 Q And how long have you been employed by the Whatcom County

14 Sheriff's Office?

15 A The sheriff's office, 1987. I started in the jail.

16 Q Okay. You said that you're a lieutenant?

17 A Yes.

18 Q How long have you been a lieutenant? Walk me through your

19 promotions.

20 A Oh geesh.

21 Q And years, I don't need the month, just ballpark. You said

22 that you started in '87?

23 A '87 in the jail and '90 to patrol. '97, I was promoted to

24 sergeant.

25 Q Okay.



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1 A I don't recall when I was promoted to lieutenant, probably

2 2003, 2004'ish. Sorry. I don't remember.

3 Q When you became a lieutenant, was it because the position

4 opened up?

5 A Yes.

6 Q Who was occupying the position before you? If my question

7 makes sense -- who created the vacancy?

8 A Yeah. I'm trying to remember when I was lieutenant or --

9 excuse me -- when I was sergeant. I believe that it was

10 DeFreece and Tony Ferry were lieutenants.

11 Q Okay.

12 A I believe that that's when Tony left and eventually Steve

13 DeFreece retired and went to Nooksack Tribe, so I don't know

14 exactly if there was a couple of others.

15 Q And you've been a lieutenant since?

16 A Yes.

17 Q What's the role of a lieutenant? What's your job function?

18 A The short answer is supervise the supervisors. Whether it's

19 patrol sergeants or sergeants other than -- other units,

20 traffic, detectives, drug task force or administrative

21 sergeant. So depending on which assignment you have, you

22 either have patrol folks or the specialties.

23 Q Okay. Your position is supervised directly by who?

24 A Chief criminal deputy.

25 Q Okay.



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1 A Currently held by Doug Chadwick.

2 Q Is there a civil deputy, a civil lieutenant and you're the

3 criminal lieutenant?

4 A No, no. Maybe a number of years ago, that's how it was set up.

5 I think even before I got promoted to lieutenant, there used to

6 be one that they would call lieutenant of operations and

7 lieutenant of services. I believe prior to my promotion that

8 lieutenant of services came over into operations.

9 Q Okay. So now how many lieutenants are there?

10 A Two. There's always been two.

11 Q And you're fluid as far as what you're supervising? You're

12 both doing sharing the same load essentially?

13 A Essentially.

14 Q Okay. Do you know Paul Murphy?

15 A I do.

16 Q How do you know Paul Murphy?

17 A He was a deputy sheriff with the sheriff's office.

18 Q Okay. Prior to the deposition today, did you do anything to

19 prepare?

20 A Yes.

21 Q What did you do to prepare?

22 A I reviewed documents that I prepared and met with the county

23 prosecutor.

24 Q Which county prosecutor? Liz Gallery?

25 A Liz Gallery.



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1 Q Okay. What did you talk about when you met with Liz?

2 A My involvement with the -- with this case.

3 Q And how long was that meeting?

4 A Wow, an hour and change.

5 Q When was the meeting?

6 A Maybe a week ago.

7 Q What topics were covered in the meeting?

8 A My involvement with this investigation with Mr. Murphy.

9 Q Did your conversation include things that you have not

10 memorialized, things are outside of documents that you

11 reviewed?

12 A Not that I recall.

13 Q Did you express opinions?

14 A No.

15 Q Did she ask for opinions?

16 A No.

17 Q Did she ask you about the credibility of others in the

18 department and what others in the department are saying in this

19 case?

20 A I don't specifically recall that. It may have come up, but I

21 don't have a -- no specific recollection of a conversation like

22 that.

23 Q Okay. Do you know Kevin Mede?

24 A Yes.

25 Q How do you know Kevin Mede?



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1 A He's a sergeant with the sheriff's office.

2 Q How long have you known Kevin Mede?

3 A Since he's been hired. I don't know what that timeline is.

4 Q He came on after you?

5 A Yes. Most definitely.

6 Q Do you have an opinion as to his credibility, his truthfulness?

7 A Yes.

8 Q What is your opinion?

9 A I -- that he's truthful.

10 Q Have you ever had any reason to question that, any issues come

11 up where you have wondered?

12 A Where I personally wondered?

13 Q Yes.

14 A No.

15 Q Are you aware of other people in the department questioning his

16 truthfulness?

17 A Yes.

18 Q And how did you resolve the conflict between people in the

19 department saying one thing and you thinking another?

20 MR. KAMERRER: I want to insert an objection that it

21 lacks foundation, calls for speculation. Nevertheless, in a

22 deposition, you can answer the question.

23 THE WITNESS: My personal experiences with Sergeant

24 Mede, plus what we learned -- what I learned during that time

25 that we were questioning some people that had brought forward



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1 in their minds some questions as to his credibility. After

2 weighing that, I still feel that he's very credible.

3 Q (By Mr. Butler) Was the -- what was the nature of the

4 allegation that you investigated?

5 A One aspect was about a traffic stop that had occurred a few

6 years earlier and another was his supervisory style. How some

7 people didn't think that he was as forthcoming with information

8 in their opinion.

9 Q Two separate incidents?

10 A Two separate incidents?

11 Q Yes.

12 A Yes. The traffic stop information was from a -- I want to say

13 a couple of years prior to the information brought forward as

14 to his style of supervision.

15 Q Okay. So there have been two occasions where -- two different

16 events where his credibility has been at least questioned and

17 you have looked into it and have found him to be credible?

18 A The first one, I did not look into. It was brought forward --

19 I believe that Prosecutor McEachran was made aware of it. It

20 was reviewed and it was found to be fine, acceptable. No. I

21 did not personally look into that, but I had the information

22 that had it been looked at and was determined to be acceptable.

23 Q So you didn't do any interviews, investigation with regard to

24 the traffic stop question?

25 A That is correct. I did not.



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1 Q Okay. Do you know Steve Cooley?

2 A Yes, I do.

3 Q Have you worked with him over the years?

4 A Yes. I was hired before Steve as well so yes. I have worked

5 with him since he's been here with the sheriff's office.

6 Q Most of the people that I'm going to ask you about you predate.

7 The same series of questions. Do you have an opinion about his

8 credibility and truthfulness?

9 A Yes, I do.

10 Q And what is that opinion?

11 A Very honest. Very credible.

12 Q And you're aware that he admitted to furnishing to a minor,

13 which is a crime in the State of Washington; correct?

14 A Yes.

15 Q On numerous occasions; correct?

16 MR. KAMERRER: Objection, vague. Go ahead.

17 Q (By Mr. Butler) He furnished numerous times; correct?

18 A It was more than one or two, yes.

19 Q And that's not a problem for you, to have a deputy who is

20 knowingly violating the law?

21 MR. KAMERRER: Objection, argumentative. Go ahead.

22 THE WITNESS: The situation was looked at. It was

23 investigated. It moved through the system. He received

24 discipline/punishment much like the judicial system does, and

25 we moved forward.



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1 Q (By Mr. Butler) Okay. Are you aware of other deputies who are

2 employed or recently employed, who have admitted to committing

3 crimes who are still employed?

4 A Say that again?

5 Q Sure. Are you aware of other deputies in the sheriff's

6 department, either currently employed or recently employed, who

7 have admitted to committing crimes and they retain their

8 employment?

9 A Admitted to committing a crime. Not that I'm aware of.

10 Q So you would agree that Cooley is unique in that?

11 MR. KAMERRER: I want to insert an objection that is

12 vague, overbroad, argumentative. Go ahead.

13 THE WITNESS: In my experience, yeah. He is the only

14 one that I'm aware of.

15 Q (By Mr. Butler) When he furnished alcohol to the minor, do you

16 remember what his rank was?

17 A I believe lieutenant.

18 Q Was he after that, moved to be the inspector?

19 A He may have been sergeant, but ultimately yes. Where you're

20 going is that he was eventually moved to inspector after the

21 incident.

22 Q Okay. Was that considered a promotion in the department?

23 A Yes.

24 Q Have other deputies had a problem with that as far as the

25 organizational decision to promote a person who admitted to



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1 committing a crime?

2 MR. KAMERRER: Objection. Vague, overbroad,

3 argumentative and calls for speculation.

4 Q (By Mr. Butler) If you know, have you heard deputies complain

5 about that?

6 A I have heard some people talk.

7 Q Okay. Did you participate in the investigation into the Cooley

8 matter?

9 A I did.

10 Q Okay. Do you know why -- can you explain why he wasn't

11 prosecuted if you were participating in the investigation?

12 A It was not our jurisdiction.

13 Q It was in Whatcom County; correct?

14 A It was in the city limits of Lynden.

15 Q Okay.

16 A So Lynden had primary jurisdiction. My involvement with that

17 investigation, Chief Edge had done the initial interview and I

18 can't remember her name, the woman -- Cavender, Cavendish? Any

19 way, he had conducted an interview with her and I believe that

20 it was by phone since she had already been stationed some place

21 else.

22 I received that information, reviewed that and then had

23 a discussion with Cooley and ultimately interviewed him. But

24 as far as the prosecution goes, that was Lynden's decision.

25 That -- they had primary jurisdiction on that.



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1 Q So you were --

2 A So that information was provided to the Lynden Police

3 Department.

4 Q You were aware that he furnished in other areas than just

5 Lynden city though; correct?

6 A I was aware that it was Lynden. You're telling me that it was

7 other places?

8 Q In your investigation, did you learn that there were occasions

9 where he provided alcohol outside of the city limits of Lynden

10 or was it your understanding that it was only in his home in

11 Lynden?

12 A I guess that I would have to look in the investigation.

13 That -- I don't remember that, that it was outside the city

14 limits of Lynden.

15 Q All right. Do you know Jeff Parks?

16 A Yes, I do.

17 Q Have you worked with Jeff?

18 A Yes. My entire time. He has been here longer than me.

19 Q He's the one. Do you have an opinion about his credibility,

20 his truthfulness?

21 A I do.


23 A Very honest, very straightforward. I have never had a problem

24 with him.

25 Q Okay. How about Flynn? Do you know Flynn? I apologize that I



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1 wrote down last names. I don't know everybody's first names.

2 Larry Flynn, I believe?

3 A Larry Flynn, a sergeant with the sheriff's office.

4 Q Yes.

5 A Yes, I do.

6 Q Have you worked with him?

7 A Yes. My entire time.

8 Q Do you have an opinion about his honesty and truthfulness?

9 A I do.

10 Q What is your opinion about his honesty and truthfulness?

11 A That he's honest and truthful.

12 Q Have you ever had reason to question his honesty or his

13 credibility?

14 A Not that comes to mind.

15 Q Okay. I mean, there are some people who we think are honest

16 and if they say something, we can just take it to the bank.

17 A Mm-hm.

18 Q It's no second thought.

19 A Mm-hm.

20 Q And there's other people that we think are honest that we're

21 going to think about a little bit, we're going to wonder and

22 we're going to check on.

23 So with regards to Larry Flynn, is he the kind that he

24 says it, that's banked? Or is he somebody that he says it and

25 you're going to think about it a little bit, but you still



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1 think he's credible?

2 A Now, there --

3 MR. KAMERRER: I'm going to insert an objection that

4 it's vague and overbroad. It's argumentative and it lacks

5 foundation. Go ahead.

6 THE WITNESS: The reason that I paused is that Larry

7 is another person that's been here longer than I have. So he

8 and I have had a lot of -- he was my supervisor in detectives,

9 for instance. We have had a lot of interaction. He is one of

10 those people that I do take it to the bank. I don't question

11 when he brings somebody up.

12 Again, the reason that I paused is I'm trying -- I was

13 trying to think of an incident where I haven't just -- oh okay,

14 that's what Larry is bringing forward, we'll take it at face

15 value and put it in the bank as you say.

16 Q (By Mr. Butler) Okay. Is it Jason Nyhus? Deputy Nyhus?

17 A Correct.


19 A Yes.

20 Q And do you have an opinion as to his honesty and truthfulness?

21 A Yes.

22 Q What is that opinion?

23 A Jason is honest. He's a good cop. He is not -- he's very well

24 versed in what he does with K9 applications. He sometimes, in

25 my opinion, gets right to the edge of what searching may or may



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1 not be able to do.

2 But on that point, he is also very up to date, because

3 that is his job every day. I'm not as up to date as he is when

4 it comes to search and seizure, because those laws change

5 almost monthly.

6 Q Mm-hm.

7 A So when it comes to detention and searching on a stop, what you

8 can do this month versus what you could have done six or eight

9 or ten months ago, that changes. I might not have that

10 knowledge. So that causes me to -- hold on, where are we at

11 with this? Where are we at? In the -- whatever that topic may

12 be.

13 Q If I distilled down, you see Jason as having a command of that?

14 A Correct.

15 Q Harris, is it Deputy Harris? Sergeant Harris?

16 A Deputy.

17 Q Deputy Steve Harris.

18 A Yes.

19 Q Yes. Do you know him?

20 A Yes, I do.


22 A Yes, I have.

23 Q Do you have an opinion as to his truthfulness and honesty?

24 A Yes.




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1 A When it comes to work, he is very truthful and honest.

2 Q That seems to be a new distinction from the previous five

3 people that I have asked you about.

4 A That is correct.

5 Q Can you explain that?

6 A I have had an occasion a couple times, not duty related, to

7 find out information from Deputy Harris -- again, not work

8 related stuff -- that I know not to be true.

9 Q Can you give me an example?

10 A Specifically statements that I supposedly made in conversations

11 that I have had with him over the years, knowing perfectly well

12 that we never had that. And he would proponent -- pass it

13 forward that we had had that conversation.

14 Q But not work related?

15 A Correct.

16 Q Jeremy Freeman, do you know Jeremy?

17 A I do.

18 Q Have you worked with Jeremy?

19 A I have.

20 Q Do you have an opinion about his truthfulness and credibility?

21 A I do.


23 A I question his truthfulness and credibility.

24 Q Why?

25 A Because he's lied to me.



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1 Q In what capacity?

2 A After he went to the Lynden Police Department, I had occasion

3 to talk about him, reference a couple of different topics, and

4 I'll try to put these -- reviewing the K9 training aids for

5 narcotics. We did a review of the policy, so I had some

6 questions for him after he had left. And then there was also

7 discussion with -- with Jeremy referenced the -- he had our K9

8 and still had that dog at home and we were trying to work out

9 the transfer of ownership and payment for that dog.

10 Q Have you ever been K9?

11 A No. I have not.

12 Q Okay. So just trying to capture the last one -- when Jeremy

13 left the department, the dog went with him?

14 A Yes.

15 Q What was the dog's name again?

16 A Sure. I don't -- I'm sorry. I don't remember the dog's name.

17 Q I remember Duce. I don't remember his new one. So the dog

18 went with him and the county wanted him to give the dog back?

19 A No. There was -- we had discussions about dog use. There was

20 still use of that dog. He and his family wanted to purchase

21 the dog, so we were -- we were having discussions on what a

22 fair price would be and the exact transfer of how we would do

23 that. Because by definition, that K9 -- my portable radio, if

24 you take the battery off, there's a bar code, so it's a county

25 tagged asset.



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1 Q Right.

2 A That K9 is a county tagged asset. So we can't just, here, take

3 that. So we have to go through disposal and things like that.

4 Q Right.

5 A Granted, the dog does not wear a bar code, but there is one

6 associated with the dog.

7 Q It's probably clipped.

8 A Yeah -- I don't know if he is or not.

9 Q So when he went to Lynden, he didn't go to Lynden as a K9 with

10 the dog in-service for the Lynden Police Department?

11 A That is correct. He did not go as a K9 handler. He basically

12 has the dog as a pet.

13 Q Right. Okay. And that's fairly common in the K9 world?

14 A Pretty common.

15 Q It's unusual that dogs after a period of service transfer

16 handlers; correct?

17 A I'm not -- I'm --

18 Q Did that get resolved?

19 A It did.

20 Q Any other reasons that you question his truthfulness?

21 A There were sometimes requests, I believe, with Sergeant Larson

22 that she had exchanges with him that needed to be vetted as far

23 as her side of the situation and his side of the situation and

24 looked into.

25 Q Okay. As a superior of his, did you ever question any of his



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1 reports or any of his work as being lacking in truthful or

2 credibility?

3 A No. Not that I recall.

4 Q What was your involvement, if any, with the Wiederspohn matter

5 that Freeman and VanderVeen were involved with?

6 A Remind me which one Wiederspohn is?

7 Q That was the one that resulted in the substantial civil verdict

8 against the county that was the rickety porch entry.

9 A No -- yes. Thank you. No. I don't think that I had any

10 involvement in that. And if I did, it was very early on and

11 very superficial. I didn't investigate. I didn't interview.

12 Q Okay. So that doesn't come into any truthfulness or

13 credibility issues with you with regard to him?

14 A Correct.

15 Q Trevor VanderVeen, do you know him?

16 A I do.

17 Q Do you have an opinion? Have you worked with him?

18 A Yes, I have.

19 Q Do you have an opinion about his truthfulness and credibility?

20 A Yes, I do.


22 A I think that he's a good cop. I think that he's truthful. As

23 I mentioned about Deputy Nyhus, Trevor also is a hard charger

24 in knowing what the up to date latest rulings are in his

25 situation.



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1 Q Okay. Have you ever had complaints or had reason to question

2 from other people about Trevor's credibility or truthfulness?


4 Q Okay. Is it Steve Roff?

5 A Yes.

6 Q Steve Roff, do you know Steve Roff?

7 A I do.

8 Q Employed with the sheriff's office; correct?

9 A Correct. He's currently a detective.

10 Q All right. Have you worked with him?

11 A I have not worked a case directly with him, no.

12 Q Have you been able to form an opinion about his credibility for

13 -- and truthfulness?

14 A Yes.

15 Q What is your opinion?

16 A That he's credible and truthful.

17 Q Taddonio, Deputy Taddonio. Do you know him?

18 A I do.


20 A Not cases directly.

21 Q Okay. Have you been able to form an opinion as to his honesty

22 and credibility?

23 A Yes.

24 Q And what's that opinion?

25 A He's honest. He has integrity.



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1 Q Okay. Any reason to question it that you've heard of?

2 A Again, I go back to the use that I use with Nyhus. Taddonio

3 was one of the members of CIT, Criminal Interdiction Team.

4 They are a proactive unit. They are expected to go out and if

5 we have warrants, probable cause for an individual for

6 something, it is -- go find them. And also drug trafficking,

7 known areas where paths may cross.

8 He too stays up to the minute on search and seizure,

9 what you can and can't do when it comes to specifically that.

10 He prior to his -- prior to his appointment in K9, I mean, he

11 lived that every day.

12 Some people have questioned, well, you can't do that or

13 you pushed that too far and every time that that's even been

14 questioned, he's -- from what I know -- well within the

15 boundaries of acceptable.

16 Q Okay. Beth Larson?

17 A Mm-hm.

18 Q Do you know her?

19 A I do.

20 Q Have you worked with her in your capacity in the sheriff's

21 office?

22 A I have.

23 Q Have you been able to form an opinion as to his truthfulness

24 and honesty?

25 A I have.



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2 A She's truthful and honest.

3 Q Take it to the bank type?

4 A Mm-hm.

5 Q Or do you have a question?

6 A No. I can take it to the bank.

7 Q Deputy Funk, do you know him?

8 A Yes, I do.


10 A I have.

11 Q And have you formed an opinion as to his credibility,

12 truthfulness and honesty?

13 A I have.


15 A Very truthful and very honest.

16 Q When you met with Liz Gallery, did you talk about any of those

17 people that we just listed off?

18 A Again, not that I specifically recall.

19 Q All right.

20 (Marked Deposition Exhibit No. 16)

21 Q (By Mr. Butler) I'm showing you what has been marked as

22 Exhibit 16. We're continuing the numbering from yesterday's

23 deposition, that's why you're not starting with one. This

24 purports to be an e-mail from Kevin McFadden to you on

25 March 7th, 2008 regarding a Murphy memo. Do you see that?



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1 A Mm-hm.

2 Q Who is Kevin McFadden?

3 A A sergeant with the sheriff's office.

4 Q Okay. Do you recall in preparing for your deposition today,

5 reviewing this e-mail?

6 A I could, but I don't specifically remember it -- I don't

7 specifically remember reviewing this in getting ready.

8 Q Okay. If you want to take a second and read it if you can.

9 The question that I have is: This is dated 2008, it involves

10 Paul Murphy and the transition of computers with Roff. Do you

11 recall a transition of computers between Murphy and Roff?

12 A Yes, I do.

13 MR. KAMERRER: Go ahead and read the whole thing and

14 then...

15 THE WITNESS: Okay.

16 Q (By Mr. Butler) This e-mail would indicate that as of March in

17 '08, you were aware that Murphy was concerned about

18 investigative files on his computer being secure. Do you

19 recall that?

20 A I don't remember having a discussion or any interaction with

21 Paul that he thought that his stuff was secure. I'm sorry.

22 Maybe I misunderstood what you asked.

23 Q You don't recall Paul being concerned about the security of his

24 investigative files?

25 A I guess that I don't have a specific incident in mind. I do



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1 recall that he wanted to continue on in the investigation.

2 Q The last paragraph is instructing Paul to transfer the hard

3 copy to Steve and remove the data from the shared drive and he

4 didn't feel that it was secure enough and he put the data on

5 thumb drives in the safe?

6 A The shared data which we didn't feel was secured enough.

7 Q Is that what it says?

8 A It says we.

9 Q Right. Do you recall conversation about the question of

10 security of documents on the shared drive?

11 A Not specifically. But obviously it was a concern with McFadden

12 and those involved. He's -- when he says we, he's writing

13 this -- I don't think that he's including me in this we.

14 Q No. I didn't mean to imply you.

15 A Okay.

16 Q You were -- you were being made aware that there was a concern

17 about security on the shared drive?

18 A According to this, yes.

19 Q Are you aware of other files that are kept on thumb drives as

20 opposed to the county computers?

21 A I'm not aware of any.


23 Q (By Mr. Butler) Showing you what's been marked as Exhibit 17.

24 This is an e-mail from Paul Murphy to you and others on

25 December 31st, 2011. GIG notes for December of 2011 with the



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1 note on the front saying, "Some interesting Bandidos and HA

2 intel in this one." Do you recall receiving this e-mail?

3 A It looks vaguely familiar. I don't know if I specifically

4 remember it, but it's addressed to me, so I don't recall the

5 date that I received it.

6 Q Okay. Are you familiar with the Gang Intelligence Group?

7 A Prior to seeing this, no.

8 Q So the Gang Intelligence Group prior to sitting in this

9 deposition is not something you are familiar with?

10 A No. Prior to this e-mail during the -- so back in 2011, no.

11 Gang Intelligence Group is not something that I historically

12 know of prior to this.

13 Q Okay. Have you become aware of it since or is it just a one

14 time, I got this and that's all I know?

15 A Since this time, I am aware of it, since 2011 when this came

16 out.

17 Q Are you familiar with the Patrol Intelligence Group?

18 A That, I knew of and was aware of prior to the Gang Intelligence

19 Group.

20 Q What was your understanding of the Patrol Intelligence Group?

21 A The first time that I became aware of that group was

22 information that was brought forward, I believe that it was

23 from Mr. Murphy in another e-mail like this, because there is a

24 document that is quote, the PIG, Patrol Intelligence Group,

25 that got forwarded on.



27

1 Q Do you recall in December of 2011 when you got this, if this

2 was a prop that Paul was forwarding information to you,

3 regarding the GIG and the PIG?

4 A Without looking at the exact e-mail flow and dates and times,

5 the short answer is, yes, that was a problem.

6 Q What was the general nature of the problem?

7 A One of these -- at least one of these documents was forwarded

8 from his home e-mail.

9 Q Okay.

10 A Which, he had been talked to prior to that, don't do that,

11 don't use your home e-mail for county business.

12 Q Okay. Had he been allowed to do investigations into the gang

13 stuff at this point?

14 A What exactly he was investigating while he was in detectives, I

15 couldn't tell you exactly what he was or wasn't doing.

16 Q Okay. In December of 2011, was he in detectives?

17 A I don't recall. I would -- we would have to look at his

18 rotation dates.

19 Q So if he's not -- follow me with this.

20 A Okay.

21 Q If he's not allowed by the county to be engaged in

22 investigations into the Outlaw motorcycle gangs or something

23 like that, how would you expect him to communicate information

24 that he had about an investigation?

25 MR. KAMERRER: Objection, calls for speculation. Lack



28

1 of foundation.

2 THE WITNESS: Yeah. I --

3 Q (By Mr. Butler) You were aware in December of '11 that he was

4 under the microscope by management; correct?

5 MR. KAMERRER: I'll object to the use of the term,

6 under the microscope. It is ambiguous and argumentative. Go

7 ahead.

8 THE WITNESS: Yeah. I'm not sure how that -- how to

9 answer that. I -- under the microscope, this Patrol

10 Intelligence Group e-mail came out. The fact that it has the

11 word intelligence -- an intel file is different than an

12 investigative file. I was not aware of this group until it was

13 brought forward.

14 We, Whatcom County, don't have a representative within

15 this group. I'm not aware that we ever sent anybody to this

16 group. We didn't have a chance to vet the information prior to

17 it going out. I called and I don't remember the officer's

18 name. I think that she was with Burlington PD. She was the

19 contact person for the PIG.

20 Q Mm-hm.

21 A I asked her who she sent that to and how we were getting it. I

22 believe that she said Derek Bogle. Derek Bogle, who was one of

23 our deputies, used to work down in either Burlington or Mount

24 Vernon. I asked her who -- if she knew Paul Murphy. She had

25 no idea who Paul Murphy was.



29

1 I asked her if she had, you know, did he contribute

2 anything to the group? Was he -- she said no. She wasn't

3 aware of who he was. So the concern that I had with this

4 coming forward is that we had a vetting process. We want to

5 look at it and make sure that it's credible information. And

6 when it's called intelligence, you just don't get to forward

7 that on. There are specific -- it's not WAC, CFRs that cover

8 the handling of intelligence. That's a problem just forwarding

9 intelligence on.

10 Q (By Mr. Butler) Okay. I'm a little confused. I'm not going

11 to spend a lot more time on this, but is there a problem with

12 law enforcement learning about these Joe Ortiz or Molina or

13 Rodriguez-Roman that management has to dictate down what

14 information is known?

15 MR. KAMERRER: I'm going to insert an objection that

16 it's vague.

17 Q (By Mr. Butler) Why don't you want the information unless you

18 have vetted it?

19 MR. KAMERRER: Objection. Misstates his prior

20 testimony.

21 THE WITNESS: The distinction that I'm trying to make

22 is that there's difference between an investigative file and

23 what is called intelligence. An intel file is not something by

24 law that you can just disseminate. You don't get to put that

25 out. RCW -- excuse me -- CFRs dictate that you don't do that.



30

1 That file is held specifically, and it's behind a locked door.

2 And there's only two people -- one or two people within an

3 agency that can specifically have access to that when it's

4 called intelligence.

5 Back to your question of whether we should know that

6 Hernandez or whoever is in this bulletin -- and that they're

7 bad guys and they do bad things to citizens and to law

8 enforcement -- yes. That information needs to get out.

9 Q (By Mr. Butler) Did you have that before Paul gave it to you?

10 A Did I know of some of these names before Paul gave this to me?

11 Q Did you have this intelligence before you got it from Paul?

12 MR. KAMERRER: I want to insert an objection. It's

13 vague, overbroad and confusing.

14 THE WITNESS: Back to my example. There's a

15 difference between something that's called intelligence --

16 Q (By Mr. Butler) Right.

17 A -- versus investigative files. Did I know that certain people

18 were Hells Angels and certain people were Bandidos and certain

19 people were this? Yes.

20 Q Okay. I guess that another way of asking the questions is if

21 you are off duty and you observe a crime, have information

22 about a crime, are you not allowed to share that with your

23 department because you were off duty and you didn't learn it

24 while you were in the furtherance of your job?

25 MR. KAMERRER: Objection. Vague, overbroad,



31

1 argumentative.

2 THE WITNESS: The difference between on duty or off

3 duty is not it at all.

4 Q (By Mr. Butler) No. That's my question to you. If you're off

5 duty -- you're on vacation, you're down in California, and you

6 see somebody who is a known wanted person.

7 A Mm-hm.

8 Q You're not going to apprehend them because you're on vacation.

9 Is it your position that you can't share that information

10 because you're off duty?

11 MR. KAMERRER: Same objection.

12 THE WITNESS: I would share that information.

13 Q (By Mr. Butler) Okay. And can you use your personal phone or

14 your wife's phone or your son's phone to convey that

15 information?

16 A Yes.

17 Q Okay.


19 Q (By Mr. Butler) Showing you what's been marked as Exhibit

20 No. 18. This is a memo from David -- Deputy David Scott to you

21 on February 9th. Do you recognize the memo?

22 A I do.

23 Q The subject of the memo is his telling you what happened at a

24 SECTOR training on February 7th. Do you recognize that?

25 A Yes.



32

1 Q Why did you request David Scott to do this?

2 MR. KAMERRER: Objection, lack of foundation.

3 Q (By Mr. Butler) Did you request David Scott to write this

4 memo?

5 A Yes.

6 Q Why did you request David Scott to write this memo?

7 A Information had come forward that Murphy had made some comments

8 during this SECTOR class that there was information that -- on

9 his computer that he did not want IT to have access to.

10 Q Okay. Who gave you that information? You say that it came

11 forward?

12 A I believe that I got it from Sheriff Elfo.

13 Q Were you at the SECTOR training?

14 A Was I in the class?

15 Q Yes.

16 A No.

17 Q Do you know if Sheriff Elfo was in the SECTOR training class?

18 A I don't believe that he was.

19 Q Tell me about how you were assigned then, if neither of you

20 were in there, to request David Scott write this memo, if you

21 know?

22 A They observed this behavior.

23 Q They being who?

24 A I'm sorry. Rodger Funk was the other instructor during this

25 training.



33

1 Q Okay.

2 A Exactly how it got there, I don't personally know.

3 Q What were you told as to how it got there?

4 A The sheriff told me that he had received information. I'm

5 assuming that they -- David and Paul -- excuse me. David and

6 Rodger had informed him or somebody else who then informed the

7 sheriff.

8 Q Just so that I'm clear -- and I think that we can move on. Do

9 you know who told the sheriff about what happened at the SECTOR

10 meeting that you are tasked with investigating?

11 A I don't specifically recall.

12 Q Okay. Do you recall any conversations with Sheriff Elfo about

13 this when he gave you the assignment?

14 A Yeah. In my -- in my memo, we had a discussion and it was

15 decided that we would get that information of what occurred

16 from David Scott and Rodger Funk.

17 Q Okay. Was this discussed with Liz Gallery in the meeting that

18 you had with her?

19 MR. KAMERRER: Objection, vague.

20 THE WITNESS: I don't specifically recall. I mean,

21 it's part of the file, so it's possible. I don't specifically

22 remember reading this memo with Liz Gallery.

23 Q (By Mr. Butler) Do you recall talking about the investigation

24 of the SECTOR class?

25 A Yes.



34

1 Q And do you recall discussing how you knew the information? Who

2 gave you the information to get the investigation started?

3 A Yes.

4 Q Did you recall telling Liz more than you have told me today, as

5 to how you knew to contact Funk and Scott through Elfo? How

6 Elfo knew to tell you to do that?

7 A No.

8 Q Okay.


10 Q (By Mr. Butler) Handing you Exhibit No. 19, which is a memo

11 from you to detective -- or Deputy Murphy on February of 14th,

12 2012, do you recognize that?

13 A I do.

14 Q Is this a document that you reviewed prior to your deposition?

15 A I don't believe so.

16 Q Okay. Do you recall writing it?

17 A Just let me read through it, but yes. I think that the answer

18 is yes. Okay.

19 Q Was this of your thought and doing or were you directed to do

20 this?

21 A This -- to put in context of the timeline from what I recall,

22 this memo accompanied the computer that was given back to Mr.

23 Murphy after the initial one was taken. This allowed him, that

24 computer in this memo here, go back to patrol.

25 Q Okay. There's no policy referenced in this; correct?



35

1 A Correct. In this memo, no, there is not a specific policy

2 reference.

3 Q Is there a policy in -- was there a policy that you could have

4 cited in this memo regarding what's contained in this memo?

5 A Probably.

6 Q Are you aware if there was or not at that time?

7 A There is a policy from IT or from Whatcom County that refers to

8 the use of county owned computers and the technologies.

9 Q Did you define in the last sentence of the first paragraph, you

10 are not authorized to make any changes to the computer? Did

11 you define what that meant?

12 A No.

13 Q Is there a definition in the policy that you just referenced as

14 to how that is defined?

15 A Say that again?

16 Q You said that there's a policy?

17 A A county wide policy.

18 Q That's not referenced here; correct?

19 A Correct.

20 Q Do you know if that policy that you're referring to defines

21 what changes -- the word changes to the computer? What that

22 means?

23 A I am not aware of it.

24 Q Do you have an opinion as to what you intended when you wrote

25 those words?



36

1 A Yes.

2 Q What's your -- what was your intent?

3 A The changing of any of the issued hardware or software.

4 Q Okay.


6 Q (By Mr. Butler) Showing what's been marked as Exhibit No. 20,

7 this is an e-mail from you to Doug Chadwick on February 22nd,

8 2012, "Subject: Memo." It says, "Attached from 2008."

9 A Mm-hm.

10 Q On Page 2 is a memo from you dated March 5, 2008 to Chief

11 Parks. Do you recall these two -- sending an e-mail to

12 Chadwick in February and attaching the memo that's Page 2?

13 A I remember the attached memo. I don't specifically have a

14 recollection of attaching this to Chadwick. Obviously, it

15 appears that I did that in 2012.

16 Q Okay. Let's look for a moment at the memo from '08.

17 A Mm-hm.

18 Q You met with Murphy and asked to look in his computer; correct?

19 A Correct.

20 Q That's -- I'm referring to essentially the second paragraph.

21 A Mm-hm.

22 Q Where were you when that happened?

23 A Where?

24 Q Where were you when that viewing of the computer took place?

25 A Where were we physically?



37

1 Q Physically, where were you?

2 A At that point, we were at the traffic in the Cascade -- prior

3 to moving to Laurel Fire Hall, we had an office within the

4 Cascade Business Park. Within that set of offices, traffic had

5 a room and we were in that room. There was a meeting table

6 there, I think.

7 Q Okay. Did you ever find anything that was inappropriate on his

8 computer in '08?

9 A No.

10 Q And you looked in '08; correct?

11 A I did.

12 Q You were aware in '08 that he had concerns about trusting IT?

13 A He made that statement.

14 Q Was there any policy violation in '08?

15 MR. KAMERRER: Object, vague.

16 Q (By Mr. Butler) Did this memo -- was there a policy violation

17 that was related to this memo and your investigation of this?

18 A No.

19 Q Back to the e-mail, do you know why you sent this in 2012, an

20 '08 memo?

21 A I do not.

22 Q Are you aware of an investigation going on into Paul Murphy

23 that Chadwick was conducting and caused him to ask you for

24 this?

25 A I wasn't aware that Chief Chadwick was investigating anything



38

1 different than what we were working on when it came to why

2 we're sitting here today.

3 Q Okay. How well known would you say in the department Murphy's

4 opposition to Elfo and the election was in the department?

5 A How well known was it in the department?

6 Q Yeah.

7 A It wasn't a secret, so it was known.

8 Q Okay. Were you aware as a lieutenant that Elfo had tasked

9 Cooley and others to monitor Murphy's Facebook and other web

10 postings?

11 A I'm not sure that I was aware that he, the sheriff

12 specifically, told people to do that. I was aware that Mr.

13 Murphy was posting things. He had a page -- I can't remember

14 the name of it -- that other people were talking about seeing

15 information on.

16 Q Okay. Had you ever looked at the Un-Elect Elfo or Boot Elfo

17 Facebook page?

18 A No.

19 Q Are you aware of a Whatcom County Sheriff's Office Facebook

20 page?

21 A Yes.

22 Q Have you ever been or are you administrator of that page?

23 A No.

24 Q And have you ever posted anything on that page?

25 A No.



39

1 Q On March -- sorry. On February 20th, did you take a computer

2 from Paul Murphy?

3 A What year?

4 Q I'm sorry. 2012.

5 A It sounds about right.

6 Q You met him at the Laurel Station?

7 A Yes. I did meet with Paul at the Laurel Station.

8 Q With Beth Larson and Chief Edge?

9 A Correct. I don't remember the exact date is why I'm

10 questioning it.

11 Q Did you review in preparation for your deposition your

12 testimony to Inspector Cooley that was taken on March 22nd,

13 2012?

14 A Yes.

15 Q So focussing on the February 20th meeting at Laurel Station

16 where you took his MDT.

17 A (Witness Indicating).

18 Q Why did you do that? Who told you to do that?

19 A I believe that earlier in the day, there was a discussion in

20 the conference room. There was a number of people in

21 attendance: Myself, the sheriff, and the undersheriff, and I

22 believe Chief Chadwick was there. I believe Dan Gibson from

23 the prosecutor's office was there.

24 The discussion was -- during the discussion, it was

25 determined that we would -- I would meet with Paul and get his



40

1 computer.

2 Q Okay. What was the reason that the five or six of you decided

3 that you needed to get his computer?

4 A I can't remember what their reasoning was now. I know what my

5 reasoning was.

6 Q What was discussed? And then we'll get to what your reasoning

7 was.

8 A The potential for information on that computer to have been

9 accessed outside of the county network that a county issued MDT

10 comes with, for instance, access allows -- access is the

11 program that goes via the State Patrol for obtaining

12 information is not generally -- or is not available to the

13 public.

14 Q Right.

15 A It goes into a secure website and it goes into secure service,

16 et cetera. There was question and concern that that may have

17 been compromised via that computer.

18 Q What was the source of the concern that it was compromised?

19 A The deduction of what was learned in the SECTOR class that Funk

20 and David Scott had brought forward, referenced Murphy's

21 statements, information about Murphy saying that he had cloned

22 the drive or copied it. If there was more than one of that, my

23 understanding is if that drive is cloned or copied and is then

24 put into another machine, then that machine would access those

25 other systems without authorization.



41

1 Q Okay. Do you recall there being discussion in that meeting

2 about his burning the Koran reference and not apologizing for

3 that?

4 A I'm sorry, say that -- burning the Koran?

5 Q Do you recall in that discussion concern about his posting

6 about not apologizing for if the Koran were to get burnt?

7 A I don't have a recollection about that.

8 Q Do you recall that being discussed at any time that people were

9 concerned about his beliefs and views were outside the norm?

10 A I don't have any recollection of any specific conversations

11 about burning the Koran.

12 Q Okay. Was Murphy given advance notice of, we're going to come

13 meet tonight and take your MDT, so please meet us in 10 hours

14 so we can get your MDT? Was he given advance notice that he

15 was going to have his computer taken?

16 A No.

17 Q And to your knowledge, what was the result of searching the

18 computer?

19 A I didn't have anything to do with searching the computer.

20 Q Did you hear the outcome of this review of his computer?

21 A I don't specifically remember that. That wasn't part of what

22 my involvement was.

23 Q And later in March, you participated in suspending Paul Murphy;

24 is that correct?

25 A I don't remember the exact dates, but yes.



42


2 Q (By Mr. Butler) Exhibit 21, is that your handwriting?

3 A On this first page?

4 Q Yes.

5 A Yes, it is.

6 Q Do you recall being, on 2/10/12 at approximately 2010 hours at

7 Laurel Fire Hall with Paul Murphy?

8 A Yes, I do.

9 Q Does that refresh your recollection as to the date that you

10 wrote on this form?

11 A Yes, it does.

12 Q Okay. Did you review this with Liz Gallery?

13 A Yes.

14 Q This is a three-page document. The first question, you're

15 directing him to power down the computer and hand it to you.

16 We've already discussed that you didn't give him notice ahead

17 of time on that; correct?

18 A When you say notice, no. Your earlier example, did we tell him

19 10 hours in advance? No. His sergeant -- I believe that it

20 was Sergeant Larson that night when Paul came on duty, asked

21 him to come meet us at the Laurel Fire Hall -- meet her at the

22 Laurel Fire Hall.

23 Q Okay. So he had no opportunity to do anything to his computer

24 because it was a surprise to him; correct? On that particular

25 shift?



43

1 A Whether he did anything to it prior to, I don't know. But we

2 did not tell him ahead of time.

3 Q Okay. You asked him, is there a power-on password? Write it

4 down and give it to me? He said, I do. Is that your

5 handwriting?

6 A Yes.

7 Q And the power-on password is on Page 2?

8 A Correct.

9 Q And then -- so he gave that to you?

10 A Yes.

11 Q County log-on user, and that is what is referred to on Page 3?

12 A That's correct.

13 Q And he gave that to you?

14 A He did.

15 Q Okay. He told you that that's the county issued hard drive in

16 the computer?

17 A I read him that question.

18 Q And he said yes?

19 A Correct.

20 Q Do you know subsequent to that if that was true or not? Has

21 anybody told you -- I understand that you didn't do the

22 forensic work -- but has anybody told you whether it was a

23 county owned hard drive in the computer that you seized that

24 night?

25 A I believe -- I heard that it was not.



44

1 Q Who did you hear that from?

2 A Um, Chief Edge.

3 Q Okay. You are ordered to turn over any cloned or modified hard

4 drive to you and he said that you don't have one?

5 A Don't have one.

6 Q There was an internal done where Chief Cooley was interviewing

7 Murphy in May. Do you recall that?

8 A Yes.

9 Q Can you explain why you were there?

10 A Yes.

11 Q Why were you there?

12 A I had been involved from this early on, so I had an overview of

13 the whole situation. Primarily, my focus was to follow along

14 with the questions that Inspector Cooley was asking.

15 The questions were written out ahead of time and

16 numbered. I focused on the question that he was asking and

17 then was looking at the next question in the list, making sure

18 that those questions that he had were asked.

19 During interviews, as you were probably aware, you have

20 a train of thought and you're going down. But then the

21 conversation sometimes turns and I just wanted to make sure

22 that -- when we discussed it ahead of time -- to make sure that

23 we got back on track and stayed with and made sure that all of

24 the questions were answered.

25 Q But you were a witness in the investigation; correct? I mean,



45

1 some of the allegations, you were like, a witness to; correct?

2 A I -- as far as what the allegations -- I mean, I got -- I got

3 Paul's computer. Yes. I did do that.

4 Q Okay. You were a part of the surrendering his firearm?

5 A Yes.

6 Q The guild objected to you being there. Do you recall that?

7 A On one occasion, yes.

8 Q Okay. I'm curious if the role that you played was to make sure

9 that Cooley asked the questions that were written, and this is

10 a recorded statement. Is that because the department doesn't

11 think that Cooley can follow a script?

12 A No.

13 Q Okay. Was there nobody else in the department who wasn't part

14 of the underlying allegations investigation who could have sat

15 in and babysat Cooley to make sure that he asked the questions?

16 MR. KAMERRER: Objection. It's vague, argumentative

17 and lack of foundation.

18 THE WITNESS: Nobody needed to baby sit Inspector

19 Cooley.

20 Q (By Mr. Butler) So --

21 A Part of the reason that I sat in was also to clarify any

22 information that he was not aware of.

23 Q And is that proper protocol in an investigation?

24 A To have somebody with knowledge of the case available, yes.

25 Q So this isn't an independent investigation by Cooley?



46

1 MR. KAMERRER: Objection. Vague. Argumentative.

2 THE WITNESS: Cooley's investigation includes a number

3 of different pieces of information, some that were obtained by

4 me. Some that were obtained by Chief Edge, some that may have

5 been obtained by IT. It's multiple sources of information that

6 Cooley uses.

7 Q (By Mr. Butler) Okay. Did he interview you?

8 A He -- Inspector Cooley?

9 Q Yes.

10 A Yes.

11 Q And why did he interview you?

12 MR. KAMERRER: Objection, calls for speculation. Go

13 ahead.

14 THE WITNESS: Yeah. I --

15 Q (By Mr. Butler) Did he interview you because you had

16 information about the investigation that he was conducting?

17 A Yes.

18 Q Why didn't you do the investigation and have -- why didn't --

19 why did you have Cooley do the investigation instead of

20 yourself?

21 A I don't -- I don't have input on who does the investigation,

22 that's not my role.

23 Q Were you tasked with sitting in on the interview or was that

24 your own doing?

25 A I was tasked.



47

1 Q And who tasked you to do that?

2 A I don't remember if it was a specific person or if it was part

3 of the discussions that we had meeting with the various people

4 involved, as I mentioned earlier, the sheriff, undersheriff,

5 the prosecutor's office, myself, Chief Chadwick.

6 Q So those all endorsed, if you will, the idea of you sitting in

7 Cooley's investigation of Paul Murphy?

8 MR. KAMERRER: Objection, misstates his testimony.

9 THE WITNESS: I guess that I -- whether they endorsed

10 it or not, I don't know what they -- they did not object.

11 Q (By Mr. Butler) They knew before you sat there --

12 A They knew.

13 Q -- that you were going to sit in on the interview?

14 A Yes.

15 Q And none of those people said that that's a bad idea?


17 Q Do you recall when you were interviewed, before or after Murphy

18 was interviewed?

19 A I don't.

20 Q Okay. Rely on the records of that?

21 A Sure.


23 Q (By Mr. Butler) Showing you Exhibit 22, an e-mail from Murphy

24 to you and others, on June 27th.

25 A Mm-hm.



48

1 Q Do you recall that?

2 A I recall having a couple of exchanges with Mr. Murphy reference

3 equipment, yes.

4 Q Okay. Had he been separated at that point?

5 A Again, I -- I believe so. I don't remember the exact date.

6 Q Okay.


8 Q (By Mr. Butler) Exhibit 23 is an e-mail from Chadwick and you

9 and Murphy the next morning regarding -- well, do you recognize

10 Exhibit 23? There's actually a couple of e-mails on there.

11 A Let me play catch up here, just a sec.

12 Q They start bottom to top.

13 A Okay. Yes.

14 Q Do you have any problem with this communication? Was Paul

15 being hostile, obtuse? Anything from your recollection of this

16 exchange?

17 A No.

18 Q Okay. It starts off at the bottom that you're telling him that

19 the shop removed the mag-lite and the charger, that you're

20 going to pick those up, and you also have the CD/DVD player

21 from the MDT and that a drive had been removed and swapped out;

22 correct?

23 A I don't specifically remember, but okay.

24 Q Well, you had the CD player?

25 A Yes. Whether it was an external or an internal, I don't



49

1 recall. But, yes, I had something from it.

2 Q Okay. And then there's a field receipt for the gun, total

3 equipment of 725 and he responds, "10-4 on the items. What has

4 either been depleted, lost or destroyed will be annotated on

5 your form as such and I'll have a copy to turn in." Please

6 deduct the $725 from payout. Do you see that?

7 A Yes.

8 Q Do you recall that? Do you recall that communication?

9 A Yes.

10 Q And then you respond in the morning, that was 5:55 PM, and then

11 the 28th in the morning, Payroll has already been submitted so

12 you can't make the deduction. You are going to need a check,

13 money order -- cashier's check or money order and does 4:00

14 work? Do you recall that? (As Read).

15 A Mm-hm.

16 Q Did that happen?

17 A We eventually did meet, yes.

18 Q Okay. Any issues or problems with that?

19 A No.


21 Q (By Mr. Butler) Exhibit 24 is e-mail exchange

22 between yourself, Mr. Murphy and Mr. Dalquest on the 3rd of

23 July 2012. Do you see that?

24 A Yes.

25 Q There's essentially three e-mails there?



50

1 A Yes.

2 Q Do you recall having any communication with Murphy with regards

3 to accessing the computer, the password issue?

4 A Just from this e-mail.

5 Q So you don't recall -- other than this, you don't have any

6 independent recollection of --

7 A No.

8 Q Do you know why you were tasked with that, being the

9 communication person?

10 A Again, specifically, no, but I was the one following up with

11 Paul on the final equipment exchange.

12 Q Okay. He provided it to you in response there at the top;

13 correct?

14 A Correct.

15 Q And to your knowledge, did that resolve the issue for Dalquest?

16 A Yeah. Just because -- there's no more. I don't specifically

17 recall if that did or did not.

18 Q Do you recall in December of 2011 rumors that -- or any time

19 before two-thousand -- before December of 2011 that Murphy was

20 going to resign?

21 A I don't -- I don't specifically recall anything that Murphy was

22 going to resign.

23 MR. BUTLER: Okay. Nothing further.

24 MR. KAMERRER: A few questions for clarification.

25 //



51

1 EXAMINATION OF SCOTT ROSSMILLER BY MR. KAMERRER

2

3 BY MR. KAMERRER:

4 Q Let me draw your attention to Exhibit 16.

5 A 16.

6 Q I'm focussing on the last paragraph there, if you want to read

7 it to yourself, just to refresh your memory.

8 A Mm-hm.

9 Q I will ask you a question about that.

10 A Okay.

11 Q Did you have concerns about the security of the shared drive

12 that law enforcement used?

13 A Do I? No.

14 Q Did you then?

15 A No.

16 Q Okay. So in the sentence that says that, I instructed Paul to

17 transfer all of the hard copy data over to Steve and remove

18 data from the shared drive, which we didn't feel was secure

19 enough -- that does not reflect your opinion of the security of

20 the shared drive, does it?

21 A That is correct. It does not.

22 Q And this was something written by Sergeant McFadden, not you;

23 correct?

24 A Correct.

25 Q Did you question the security of the shared drive after



52

1 receiving this e-mail?

2 A No.

3 Q Do you know whether Sergeant McFadden was concerned about the

4 security of the shared drive?

5 A I do not.

6 Q Let's see. Exhibit 17, the first page of that. Was this

7 e-mail that was sent to, Commissioned Deputies Spencer Kope and

8 Scott Rossmiller sent from Murphy's personal home e-mail?

9 A I don't know if this specific one was. I do know that at least

10 one of the PIG bulletins was.

11 Q Okay.

12 A Because it, you know, was from and then it would have his, you

13 know, e-mail address out the back end. So I don't know where

14 this one specifically came from.

15 Q Okay. By sending to commission deputies as this is addressed,

16 does that mean that it's going out to every deputy of the

17 Whatcom County Sheriff's Office?

18 A Correct.

19 Q Who is Spencer Kope?

20 A The crime analyst.

21 Q And he's a member of the Whatcom County Sheriff's Office?

22 A That is correct, yes.

23 Q Was it the use of Mr. Murphy's personal home e-mail that raised

24 concerns about the dissemination of the attachment there, the

25 Gang Intelligence Group information, and the Patrol



53

1 Intelligence Group information? Was that the concern that was

2 raised? In other words, that his home e-mail was not a secure

3 law enforcement controlled system?

4 A That was one concern, yes.

5 Q Okay. Do you know what partitions are in the computer?

6 A Very little knowledge but, yes, I think that I understand.

7 Q Okay. Turning to Exhibit No. 20. When you examined Mr.

8 Murphy's computer in 2008, did he start up that computer?

9 A He did.

10 Q Did he open the computer to a particular section for you to

11 look at?

12 A Yes.

13 Q What was the section that he opened it to?

14 A The main screen came up and then he went into the files.

15 Q Could you tell whether he had partitions on his computer and

16 several different locations for files?

17 A No.

18 Q Did you look at more than one partitioned area of that

19 computer?

20 A No.

21 Q When Murphy returned to the patrol division after being the

22 property crimes investigator, he swapped computers with Deputy

23 Roff; didn't he?

24 A Correct.

25 Q Okay. What was it that prompted the inquiry to look at his



54

1 computer to see whether he had information on there concerning

2 the electronic monitoring investigation?

3 A I believe that it came from Sergeant McFadden that there was a

4 question of -- whether Mr. Murphy had any files still

5 pertaining to that case on his computer.

6 Q Why was he not supposed to have those files?

7 A Because that investigation had been turned over to Roff.

8 Q Was there some evidence that Deputy Murphy was continuing to

9 perform investigations in that area?

10 A I believe Sergeant McFadden had some concerns. I don't

11 specifically remember, but that was part of the premise of

12 asking and meeting for this.

13 Q Okay. I want to turn to Exhibit 21 now.

14 A Mm-hm.

15 Q I'll draw your attention to Question No. 4 and I'll read it for

16 the record. "Is the original county issued hard drive in this

17 computer?"

18 Is that the question that you read to Deputy Murphy on

19 February 10, 2012 when you received his computer from him?

20 A Yes.

21 Q And so you read that word for word; is that right?

22 A Yes.

23 Q Okay. And his answer to that question was yes?

24 A Correct.

25 Q Okay.



55

1 A Yes, he did.

2 MR. KAMERRER: That's all of the questions that I

3 have.

4 (Signature Reserved)

5 (Deposition Adjourned)

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25



56

1 C E R T I F I C A T E

2 STATE OF WASHINGTON ) ) ss.

3 COUNTY OF ISLAND )

4 I, Kristen M. Uhlig, the undersigned CCR in and for the Stateof Washington, do hereby certify:

5 That the annexed and foregoing deposition of the witness

6 named herein was taken stenographically before me and transcribedby me;

7 I further certify that the witness examined, read, and signed

8 the deposition after the same was transcribed, unless indicated inthe record that the parties and the witness waive the signature;

9 I further certify that all of the objections made at the time

10 of said examination to my qualifications or the manner of takingthe deposition, or to the conduct of any party, have been noted by

11 me upon said deposition;

12 I further certify that I am not a relative or employee orattorney or counsel of any of the parties to said action or

13 counsel, and that I am not financially interested in the saidaction or the outcome thereof;

14 I further certify that the deposition, as transcribed, is a

15 full, true, and accurate transcript of the testimony, including allquestions and answers, and all objections, motions and exceptions

16 of counsel made and taken at the time of the foregoing examination;

17 I further certify that I am sealing the deposition in anenvelope with the title to the above cause thereon and marked

18 "Deposition Upon Oral Examination" of said witness and promptlycausing the same to be delivered or forwarded to Counsel for the

19 Opposing Party;

20 IN WITNESS THEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand and affixedmy official seal this ___ day of____________, 2014.

21

22 __________________________

23 Kristen M. Uhlig, #1934 Certified Court Reporter,

24 Residing in Clinton, Washington.

25





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marital 1:10,14marked 23:20,21

25:22,23 31:18,1934:9 36:5,6 42:147:22 48:7 49:2056:17

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23:24 24:2 25:1151:22 52:3 54:354:10

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8:24meet 39:7,25 41:13

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16:6 22:17 23:424:1 28:20 31:736:9,17,21 47:2549:15 51:8 54:14

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53:8

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18:15,16 28:1838:14

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2012 34:12 36:8,1537:19 39:4,1349:23 54:19

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66/27/2012 3:15



6/28/2012 3:16

77/3/2012 3:17725 49:3,67th 23:25 31:24

887 4:22,23

99:05AM 1:2090 4:2397 4:2398225 1:22 2:5,1398512 2:99th 31:21

lt. scott rossmiller, wcso - deposition transcript (federal)

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