9 5 12 063341 2025 afternoon portion transcript by lynn stubbs 0204

7/28/2019 9 5 12 063341 2025 Afternoon Portion Transcript by Lynn Stubbs 0204

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2/34

1 I N D E X

2 WITNESS:

3 NICHOLAS DURALDE

4

5

6

7

DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. YOUNG

CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR LESLIE

8 E X H I B I T S

9 NO.

0 MARKED PREVIOUSLY

11

12

13

14

15

16

17

18

19

20

21

22

23

24

Marked Admitted

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PAGE

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26


3/34

.

1 RENO NEVADA WEDNESDAY SEPTEMBER 5, 20 12; 10 03 A. M

0-2

3

4

5

6

TE CORT M. Coglin, w do av a copy of

codings of pocdings W can fnis i o

yo a no cos. T answ is no, yo canno cod

bcas w av official cod And will insc

8 a yo g an adio

9

0

TE DEFENDANT

TE CORT

Tank yo, si

a no cos o yo.

11 TE DEFENDANT Tank yo si

12 THE COURT: All rigt. W lft off -- I'm trying

13 o find my nos fom las im

14 MR. LESLE Yo ono, bfo w g going

15 do av a prliminary mattr, wnvr yo wis to ar

16 i

17

18

19

TE CORT

MR. LESLE

TE CORT

Wll l m s -

S.

find y nos. Okay W ad

20 Nicholas Duralde testify, Nathaniel Zarate, and then Cory

21 Gobl. And m no s if Sa don' bliv

22 Sa addssd is.

23 MR YONG Yo ono, av w fomally calld

24 cas y?

3


4/34

1 THE CORT Ys, w v. Tis is h m of

2 State of Nevada versus Zachary Barker Couglin, Couglin

3

4

(pononcing) , Im soy. I is Dpmn 2 cs,

20 11-0 6 3 3 4 1, n i is h conin il. An h

5 chgs py lcny, on con, n possssion of

6 soln popy, scon con.

8

MR YONG Thnk yo, Yo Hono

Th S hs no s. Offic Dl o

9 Dl (pononcing) , xcs m, sifi h wih

10 spc o h moion o sppss, whic his Co

11 gn in p n ni in p, ffcivly

12 An so wih spc o h il, h only wo

13 winsss h v sifi fo S in h Ss

14 cs in chif is M Z n M. Gobl.

15 Offic Dl i psn n y o sify

16 wi spc - s i pins o il.

1 TH CORT Wll, I hink h Co i inic

18 h ls hing h I wol incopo, by

19 rfrnc, ll of his prior tstimony t t motion to

20 suppress and this was to be supplemental testimony.

21 MR YONG An I cll h ws n ob jcion

22 o h. I hv Officr Drl hr ry o sify o

23 h cs. So S's y o go fow.

24 (No coing fom 10: 0 0: 48 m. )

4


5/34

1 THE COURT: All rght I wl state on the

2 record that the Court has mde a determnaton that any

3 potental conflict of nterest that exists n ths cse

4 between Mr. Lesle nd Mr Coughln does not rse to the

5 level that it would deny Mr. Coughlin hs Sxth Amendment

6 rght to be reresented by counsel.

7 And further I fnd that Mr. Lesle hs done more

8 thn n adequate job n representing Mr. Coughlin in these

9 proceedngs to dte nd will contnue to do so to the

10

11

12

13

14

concluson of tril. So

THE DEFENDANT Your Honor?

THE COURT: Mr. Young

'm sorry Your Honor f I myTHE DEFENDANT:

just nter ject quckly If there was somethng I sd

15 earler that consttuted n ex-parte communction to the

16 Court may ameliorte that now with the Courts

1 7 ndulgence

THE COURT: I wll ameliorate t.18

19 Mr Coughln did n closed proceedng, suggest

20 that one of the wtnesses in ths trial was prvy to

21 tpe-recording or a video of prt of the incident tht

22 occurred on tht dy, and that tht ws Mr Zrte. Is

23 that correct?

24 THE DEFENDANT If I may Your Honor Ill

5


6/34

E COU: Wel, orry Wa t r. Zarate?

2 E DEFENDAN: No, . And don't beleve

youre referrng to te ncdent te partclar

4 ncdent Im referrng to.

5 E COU: ere' a dfferent ncdent?

6 . ESIE: I tnk e talkng ould I

clarfy? Would you lke me to c arfy?

8 E COU: Yea, f t a notng to do wt

9 t tral.

10 . ESE: don't tnk t a anytng to do

wt t tral

12 E COU: Okay. Well, you can clarfy ten f

1 you want

. ESE14 t an alleged ncdent were one

15 of te wtnee flcked a cgarette at r. Cougln.

16

17

8

E COU: But not at t

R ES E: No

on t date?

E COU: at wat were talkng about,

19 r. Young, and tat came out, blurted out by r. Cougln,

20 tat e wa upet tat r ele ad not brougt tat to

2 te attenton of te Court.

22 . YOUN: So long a te Court' I don't

2 tnk you wl o ong a te Court not gong to

24 conder tat, nce t not evdence n t cae.

6


7/34

1 THE COURT

2 i was mproper -

3

4

MR YOUNG

THE COURT

Well, I advsed hm a tha tme that

Thank you

-- o do that, and, you know I would

5 no be consderng n hs rial

6

7

MR YOUNG

THE COURT

Thank you

-- unless was presented n the

8 tral iself and was no obeced o and was allowed to be

9 heard So And, frankly I didn' have an

10 understanding of what t was untl us now

11

12

13 Duralde

14

All rght

MR YOUNG

THE COURT

Did you want to call your wtness?

Yes. State wll call Officer

Jus for the record, I wll swear you

15 again I know you're probably stll under oath, but will

16 ou rase your rght hand

17 (Witness sworn )

8

9

THE COURT

MR LESLIE:

20 another pad of paper.

Please be seated

Your Honor, 'm gvng Mr Coughlin

21 THE COURT: All right.

22 Well, Mr Coughln, jus o clarfy ths for he

23 record, wha I had insruced you o do previously was to

24 type it on your compuer, show t to Mr. Lesle at the


8/34

1 concluon, not nterrupt m durng t. But wen e

2 finished examining or hearn everything that happens, and

3 then finishes his cross-examination, then present to him

4

5

any queton tat you w m to ak.

E DEFENDAN Ye, Your onor

All rgt?

I dd not

6 realize you had indicated not to do it during the process.

8

E COU

durng te poce.

Well, I dont want you dong t

I tougt I made t clear te lat

9 tme, becaue youre nterruptng Mr. Lele, you're

0 nterruptng ablty to properly repreent you, to

ear wat te wtne ayng and to oberve te

2 demeanor and everytng e e about te wtne; o tat if

13 youre nterruptng m, e's not able to do tat.

4

15

16

E DEFENDAN Ye, r

ESIE Your onor, I

E COU I can gve you uffcent tme at te

concluon of r. ele' croexamnaton to conult

8 wt m and gve m addtonal queton and tng tat

9

20

you w m to do All rgt?

E DEFENDAN Ye, r, Your onor. And I ut

21 note for te record tat at te concluon of r. Zarate

22 and oble croexamnaton tere wa a very bref

23 perod weren I wa allowed to addre r ele.

24 E COU: You know wat Im gong to do, I wll

8


9/34

1 take a five-minute recess at the conclusion of

2 Mr Duralde' cro-examination

THE DEFENDANT: Thank you, ir

4 THE COURT: You will ave five minutes, which I

5 think hould be more than ufficient time to how it to

6

7

Mr Lelie

to grant it.

And if he need more time, I would be happy

All right? But let' move on Right now

8 you're not to interrupt the proce

9

10

THE DEFENDANT: Ye, ir

MR LESLIE: Your Honor, I dont mean to beat a

11 dead hore, and it eem like nothing in thi cae goe

12 quickly, but I will ay thi: I appreciate the Cours

1 comment, becaue I think they will aist me in eing a

14 beter lawyer in thee proceeding without contantly

15 being interrupted and ditracted

6 I will ay thi, though, I actually do invite

17 Mr. Coughlin to ean over and wh sper f he has questions.

18 All I ask is that if I indicate to him to hold on a moment

19 o I can liten, that he honor that Other than that,

20 though, I don't have an objection to him whispering or

21 pushing me notes during, you know, any prtion during the

22 witness examination, as long as he will respect at times I

23 need to waive him off so I can listen, and then he and I

24 can confer.

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10/34

THE COURT: Well, that's fair.1

2 MR LESLIE: So I dont want hi to feel that he

3 can't talk to me.

4

5

THE COURT:

Mr. Leslie, not you

Im leavng t in the discretion of

So f he pushes you of, then yoll

6 have to honor that, but yo will have the opportunity

7 again at the conclsion of the cross-examination.

8 right?

9

10

11

2

13

THE DEFENDANT: Yes, sir

THE COURT: All right Mr Yong.

MR YOUNG: Thank you, Your Honor.

NICHOLAS DURALDE,

All

14 previosly called as a witness by the plaintiff heein,

15 being first dly sworn, was examned

6 and testfed as follows:

17 DIREC T EXAM NATION (Resmd)

8 BY MR YOUNG:

19 Q Good morning, sir Coud yo state your irst

20 and last name and spell both for the recording

21 A Nicholas Dralde.

22 last name, D-U-R-AL-D-E

23 MR. YOUNG

24 recorded, yes?

Okay

First name, N-I-C-H-O-LA-S,

And, Yor Hono, this is beng

10


11/34

E CU: Yes

YUNG: hank you

1

2

3

4

E CU: Let m try to raise it h, youre

standing up Im sorry I do apologize I didnt know

5 that you werent in the chair

6 YUNG: I didnt know you were standing

7 eithe

8 E CU: Well, he was way down in

9 the (inaudible) bottom

10

11

LESLIE:

E CU:

I do the same thing

It wasnt meant to be that

12 honest with you, you were so low down in he box

13 BY YUNG

o be

14 Q Sir, could you tell the Cout with whom you

15 currently employe?

16

1

18

1

A

Q

A

Q

he eno Police Depatment

How ong have you been so employed?

Appoximately ive ad a hal yeas

Could you tell the Cout the trainings that you

20 did to become an officer from -

21 A I participatd in a 19week PS academy and

22 after graduating that went to a 16-week field taining

23 program

24 E CU: Im sorry, what kind o taining?

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12/34

1

2

HE WINESS

THE COUR:

Field training program

Oh, fied I just didn't hear.

3 BY MR YOUNG:

4

5

Q

A

What did the field training consist of?

The trainee offcer is coup ed with a tenured

6 training officer who basica ly works from the training

7 officer, observing to, by the end of the training program,

8 the trainee officer is tracking all tasks relative to the

9 job.

10

11

12

HE COUR: Did you say "ten year or "teure"?

THE WINESS: Tenured

HE C OUR enured, okay.

13 BY MR. YOUNG

4

15

16

Q

A

Q

And did you graduate or pass the P OST academy?

Yes.

And did you pass or graduat from this field

17 training program?

18

19

A

Q

Yes

In the five and a haf years as an officer, have

20 you received updated trainings throughout that time?

21

22

A

Q

23 well?

24 A

Yes

Okay And have you passed al those trainings as

Yes.

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13/34

Q Okay Sir, I'm going to direct your attention o1

2 August 20th of 2011. Were you working on that night, on

3 that day?

4

5

A

Q

6 court?

7

8

9

A

Q

A

Yes

And did something happen which brings you here to

Yes

Could you tell the Judge what was that, please

Initially I was dispatched to a report of a

10 disturbance or possible fight in the area of the paza at

11 First and Virginia Streets . While I was driving there

12 dispatch updated us saying that larceny of a phone had

13 occurred

14 Q The ocation that you just described, is tha

15 here in Reno?

16

17

18

19

A

Q

Q

Yes

Washoe County, Nevada?

Yes

And so that being the area of 10 North Virginia

20 Street and 1 North Center Street; is that correct?

21

22

A

Q

Yes

And could you tell the Court as far as landmarks

23 here, so the Judge is familiar, what area of town you're

24 talking about?

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14/34

1 A Tht p s bodeed on one sde by the Tuckee

Rive on the south side by the Tuckee Rive noth side

3 by Fist Steet on the west side by Vigini Steet on

4 the est sde by Noth Cente Steet

5 Q

6 scene?

7

8

9

A

Q

A

Oky

Yes

Oky

When you ved -- dd you ve on

And wht dd you see o notce?

When I ved thee ws goup of people on the

10 Cente Steet bdge

11 Q Thts f d dsptch dvse you of

1 specfc subect o gve you descpton of specfc

1 subect

14

15

16

17

A

Q

A

Q

Yes

- tht ws the sub ject of the cll?

Yes

Oky And dd ou see n ndvdul mtch ng

18 tht descpton?

Yes

Oky

Yes

s tht peson n the coutoom tody?

19

0

1

A

Q

A

Q Could you tell the Judge pont out wht he's

weng tody

4 A M Coughln ws tht peson

14

He's weng


15/34

1 bege su t

MR YOG:

THE CORT:

Oky Your Honor --

The record wll reflect the

4 identifction of the defendnt, Mr Coughlin

5 BY MR YOG:

6 Q Oky d you hve ny contct wth

7 Mr Coughln?

8

9

10

A

Q

A

Yes

Oky Could you tell the Court how tht begn?

The frst thng recll syng to Mr Coughln

11 ws tht f he hd someones phone tht he cou probbly

1 gve the phone bc n the whole ssue would be settle

1 t tht tme

14

15

16

17

Q

A

Q

A

Oy

Yes

An Mr Coughln respon to you?

Wht dd he sy?

He se e h enough normton o

18 Terry stop

19

0

Q Wht hppene next, sr? Well, let me -- let me

stre tht queston d you ultmte wthout tellng

1 us wht -- specificlly wht others told you, id you hve

the opportunity to meet with other individuls on scene?

4

A

Q

Yes

o you recll the nmes of those ndvduls?

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16/34

1

2

A

Q

Yes Coy Goble n thn Zte

Oky An they gve you nomton, gn,

without giving specifics, which assisted you in your

4 investigation?

5

6

A

Q

Yes

All ght wll sk you ethe o them tol

7 you a specifc location of one of their phones?

8

9

10

11

12

A

Q

A

Q

A

Yes

An o you ecll who tht ws?

ecll both

Oky An wht ws tht locton?

Tht locton -- t ws stte tht M Goble's

1 phone ws in the efennt's left font shots pocket.

14

15

16

Q An he?

MR LESL E:

MR YOG:

Obecton hesy

An 'm only usng tht, You Hono,

1 not o the tuth, but just to estbsh wht ws one

18 next s pt o the eect on the hee s pt o the

19 nvestgton An m skng you not to conse hs

20 testmony n tht eg o tuth o the mtte

21

22 wht?

2

24

TH CORT:

MR YOG:

THE CORT:

Hs testmony n tht eg s to

m soy?

Hs - not conse hs testmony o

16


17/34

1 wht pupse?

3

4

5

MR YOG: I sked wht -- wht ws -- wht he

ws dvsed And he dvsed he eclled bth syng --

TH CORT: Well I hed --

MR YOG: -- the phne ws n M Cughlns

6 left fnt shts pcket

7 TH CORT: But wht s the pupse f tht

8 testmny?

9 MR YOG: Well ts gng t shw wht he

0 subsequentl dd s pt f ths nvestgtn

TH CORT: All ght S t's -1

MR YOG: ffect n hee essentlly Yu

1 Hn

4 TH CORT: All ght Then I'm gng t

15 veule the b jectn

16 BY MR YOG:

7 Q S wht ws -- ws M Cughln ultmtely

18 pced nt hndcus?

19

0

1

A

Q

A

cmmnds

3 Q

Yes

And f wht pupse ws tht?

M Cughln ws vey hestnt t llw

Oky All ght w gettng bck t yu

4 nvestgtn egdng phne dd yu tke ny ctns

17


18/34

to detemne whethe o not M. Coughln, n ct, hd

2 M Goble's phone?

3

4

A

Q

5 those?

6 A

Yes

And wht ctons wee those o wht steps wee

I stood ne M Coughln nd I clled the phone

7 numbe tht M Goble hd given me, his phone numbe.

Q And so M Goble gve you -- when you sy, "hs

9 phone numbe, M Goble's phone numbe?

10

11

A

Q

12 hppened?

13

14

1

16

17

1

A

Q

A

Q

Yes

Oky And when you clled tht numbe, wht

I coud he the phone vbtng

Oky Fom whee?

Fom the e o M Coughln's let ont

d you, o lck o bette wod

TH CORT: You hed the phone o phone?

TH WTSS: hed phone

19 BY MR YOG:

Q Oky And ths pont hd you - hd nybody20

21 dented phone s M Gobles phone to you? n othe

22 wods, hd you seen M Gobe's phone t ths unctue?

23 A o

24 Q Oky Hd M Coughln hnded you ove ny phone

1


19/34

idetified as M. Goble's phoe?

2

3

A

Q

o

So you ead a phoe Was that was what you

4 heard concealed on Mr . Coughlin's person or out in the

ope?

6

9

A

Q

A

Q

Cocealed o hs peso

d you stop callg that phoe umbe?

Yes

Ad aga, whe you temated, fo lack of a

10 bette wod, that phoe call, dd you otce aythg

A Yes. Whe I teated the phoe call the

2 vbatg stopped

Okay. At that juctue what happeed?3

4

Q

A At that juctue I detemed that M Coughl

was possesso of M. Goble's phoe

Q Okay Ad you dd what?6

17

A pced hm ude st

Q Okay Ad the what? I othe wods, dd you

9 take ay steps to eteve the phoe o a phoe?

20 A Yes. Pefomed a seach cdet to aest of

2 M Coughl ad took the phoe that had bee the left

22 fot pocket out of the pocket

23 Q Okay d you specfcally each ad gab

24 that phoe?

9


20/34

1

2

A

Q

es

Oky Dd Mr Coughln t ny tme hnd the

3 phone over to you?

4

6

A

Q

A

Q

o

Oky

es

And he ws under rrest t ths juncture?

When you sy, serch ncdent to rrest, " could

you descrbe to the Court wht tht s

9 A A serch ncdent to rrest s n rrest - 'm

10 sorry, serch ter someone's been tken nto custody

11 We know tht they're beng trnsported to the jl nd we

12 tke everythng out o ther pockets to ssure they hve

13 nothng llegl or nythng tht cn be used gnst n

14 ocer tht's trnsportng them

15 Q Pror to your securng or seng te phone ter

16 hs rrest, hd you t ny tme gone nto Mr Coughln's

17 pockets pror to tht tme?

1

19

20

21

A

Q

A

Q

o

As prt o the serch, men?

o

Oky Dd you tke ny steps to determne whose

22 phone tht ws?

23

24

A

Q

es

Wht dd you do?

20


21/34

The phne had a passwd n i I asked1

2

3

Gble f the passwd He was unable t pvide

4 Heasay

6

LELIE

THE COU

LELIE

Im ging bjec, Yu Hn

Tha he asked?

ell, Yu Hn, anything that

7 Gble says wuld be heasay

9

1

11

12 heading

13

14

YOUG That's fine

LELIE I mean I --

THE COUT ll igh ell, I -

LEI think thas whee we ae

THE COUT -- will susain

LLI nd Im ying be

1 cntempaneus

16 TH COUT he jectin ha Gble

17 said, bu nt as t wha he ffice said

1

19

LELI ight

YUG nd thats fine, Yu Hn

2 BY YOUG

21Q

Did yu ake seps detemine whethe nt

22 ha phne hat yu seized ut f Mr Cughin's pcke

23 was in fact Gbles phne?

24 Yes

21


22/34

1

2

3

4

6

7

9

10

Q

A

Lack f

Hnr

Okay. ere

Yes.

LLI:

fundatn.

YOUG:

. LLI:

TH COUT:

YOUG:

TH COUT:

yu able t ake that determnatn?

Im gng t bect, Yu Hnr.

If I can, a

Cals fr an ultmate cnclusn

ell

art f hs nvestgatn, Yur

Okay. I wl sustan the bectn

as t the cncusn, but nt as t whether r nt takng

12 steps t determne wh the wner was. And I guess he can

13 questn as t what steps he tk and

14 . Y OUG: Culd I apprach and cllect xhbts

1 ether A and B r 1 and 2, whatever they ae?

16

17 I d

TH COUT: ure I dnt knw f I have them.

8 Are these the exhbts yu're takng abut?

19

20 admtted

21

22 suppress

YOUG:

TH COUT:

23 BY . YOUG:

Yes. And these have prevusy been

They were admtted at the mtn t

24 Q As part f yur nvestgatn n determnng r

22


23/34

,

1 taking steps to determine i f the phone you recovered was

2 Mr Gobles, did you take photogaphs o f the phone that

3 you recoverd?

4

5

6

7

8

9

10

11

12

A

Q

Yes

Okay. Taking a look at Exhibits A and B, that

have een admitted Do you recognize those photographs?

A

Q

A

Q

A

Q

Yes

What are those, sir?

Those are photographs o f the phone

Who took those?

I did

Okay. And those is that the phone in question

13 that we're talking about?

14

15

A

Q

Yes

Okay What did you do with that phone at the

16 conclusion of your investigaion?

17 A I completed a photo release certi ficate, where

18 documented the phone by phoographing it and then gave it

19 back to Mr Goble.

20 Q Okay. And are those pictures true and accurate

21 photographs of the phone that you collected?

22

23

24

A

Q

A

Yes

So it was returned to Mr. Goble?

Yes

23


24/34

ee yu -- wha was yu aie ha nigh?

In a full plce unifm

2

3

Q

A

Q Okay And yu aived dive up he scene

4 cec in a pal ca?

5 A Yes

6 Q as ha a maked pal ca?

Yes i was7

8

A

Q Idenifying i as a en lice Depamen

9 vehicle?

0

2

3

A

Q

A

Q

Yes

Lighs n p?

Yes

And he whle nnes? Okay

4 Cughlin hand yu his phne?

A any me did

5

6

7

8

9

A

Q A any ime did Cughlin indicae yu ha

he had a phne? In he wds Gbes phne?

A

Q And ha was a bad quesin A any ime did

20 Cughlin advise yu ha he had Gbles phne?

2

22

A

Q

I'm n sue if yu emembe le us knw Abu

23 frm he ime yu arrived n scene unil he ime f

24 Mr. Cughlin's arres can yu esimae hw lng we're

24


25/34

1 talking?

2

3

4

A

Q

clear.

would estimate ive minutes.

Okay And just want to make sure that 'm

You advised that when you called the number that

5 was Mr Goble's number that was provided to you, you said

6 that it was - how do you know it was vbrating?

7 know f qute caught that.

A

Q

could hear it

Okay.

MR. YOUNG: Thats all, Your Honor

Thank you, Officer.

THE COURT: Mr. Leslie

don't

8

9

10

11

12

13

14

15

MR. LESL E: Court's ndulgence, Your Honor.

THE COURT: Yeah.

MR LESL E: 'm just going to confer with

16 Mr Coughlin real quck.

17 Thank you, Your Hono just wanted to talk to

18 Mr. Coughlin before starting the cross-examination

19

20

THE COURT:

MR. LESLE:

All right

Your Honor, do you ob ject to me

21 sttng whle examine the witness?

22

23

24 III

THE COURT:

MR. LESLE:

No, do not

Thank you, Judge

25


26/34

1 CROSS-EXAMINATION

2 BY MR LESLIE:

3 Q Officer, you indicated that you were originally

4 dispatched to what you described as a disturbance or a

5 possible fight; is that correct?

A Yes.6

7 Q And that before you arrived on scene dispatch

8 updated you and said that it might have something to do

9 with the larceny of a phone?

Yes10

11

A

Q Do you recall testfying previously at the motion

12 to suppress?

Yes13

14

15

16

A

Q

A

And that was last week?

Yes.

Q And my notes reflect that all you said at that

17 point with regard to the update on the numerous occasions

18 that both counsel asked you about the updated information

19 from dispatch was that the update was that it ight be a

20 larceny . Do you recall that?

21 A I don't.

22 Q So you said back at the suppression hearing that

23 the update information from dspatch was that it might

24 involve a larceny, but you're saying today for the first

26


27/34

1 time that dspatch told you it mght nvolve the larceny

2 of a phone?

3

4

A

Q

Yes

Okay So your testimony changed from the time of

5 the suppression hearing last week to today in that regard?

6

7

A

Q

Yes.

Do you have any reason to protect yourself in

8 ths case by making sure ths case results in a conviction

9 so that you don't get sued based on threats that

10 Mr. Coughlin may have made?

11

12

13

14

15

A

Q

No

You're aware that he's made such threats?

MR. YOUNG: I'm ust going to object, not to the

question but threats to who? It may be a vague queston

MR LESLIE: I can clarfy.

16 BY MR LESLIE:

17 Q You're aware that Mr. Coughlin has prevously

18 ndcated the possibilty of flng suit based on his

19 perception of how he was treated with regard to the

20 contact you had with him that night?

21

22

23

24

A

Q

A

Q

I honestly don't recall that.

Youve not been made aware of that?

I don't recall it.

So you don't recall whether anybody made you

27


28/34

1 aware of that?

No2

3

A

Q So they could have made you aware of that, you

4 just don't recall that at this time; is that -

No5

6

A

Q is that possible? Im trying to nal down

7 whether youre saying I was told about that, but I don't

8 remember it or Ive never been told about that or I have

been told about that Coud you help carfy that for us?9

10 A If any threats had been made, a lawsuit aganst

mysef reference my contact wth Mr Coughln Im no

12 aware of it

3 Q Okay And you indcted when you first arrived

14 on scene - and some of ths may be redundant to what yu

5 testfied to last week - thank you

6 Pardon me.

TH CRT

18 BY MR LSLI:

No robem

9 Q You indicated when you arrved on scene that you

20 were uniformed?

A

Q

Yes

You had a gun --

Yes.

2

22

23

24

A

Q that was vsble to the publc?

28


29/34

1

2

3

4

5

6

7

9

10

11

12

13

14

A

Q

A

Q

A

Q

A

Q

A

Q

A

Q

A

Q

es.

o arrived in a marked police car?

es

With ights and sirens?

My lights and sirens werent active in the day

Bt I mean they are on the vehicle?

hey are on the vehicle yes.

And youre R PD, is it?

es

So its the black and white police car?

es

Recognizable to the pblic as a police car?

es

kay Now when you first arrived on scene, you

15 got out of your vehicle, and I believe oe of the first

16 things yo noticed was a large grop of people surrounding

17 Mr. Coughlin?

1

19

A

Q

es.

And I think we established that that was anywhere

20 from, in yor estimation, to 12 people ranging in age

21 from a parent to teenagers to early 20s?

22

23

24

A

Q

A

es

And they were agitated?

es.

29


30/34

1 Q Tey appeaed o be angy o osle owads

2 M Cougln fom wa you ould ell?

4

5

6

7

8

9

10

A

Q

sdes?

A

Q

wn

em?

A

I

es

And ey wee effevely suoundng m on all

es

Some of em were seaed nex o m vey lose

nk you ndaed sx o eg nes some of

es He was sng down and on ee sde of

11 m was someone sng nex o m

12 Q kay And was anyone bend m?

14

A

Q

o

Was ee any alng o any obsuon bend

15 m a would ave pevened m jus leavng n a

16 deon bend m?

17

18

A

Q

He was sng on a alng

kay. And e was sng n su a way a e

19 was down lowe an e people wo wee sandng?

20

21

A

Q

es

kay And so e alng e was sng on I

22 nk you sad was ony abou 8 nes off e gound?

2

24

A

Q

es

kay And so jus o knd of afy wa 'm

30


31/34

askng about wth regard to anythng beng behnd hm; was

2 there any obstructon, ralng, wall, et cetera, behnd

3 hm as he sat n that poston?

4 A There was nothng behnd hm The street was

5 behnd him other than the ralng he was sttng on

6 Q Okay And were there any of these young people

7 postoned behnd hm?

8

9

A

Q

No

Okay And then some of tem were standng wthn

0 a foot or two of hm?

A I don't recal how close the people were to hm

2 tat were standng.

3

14

15

6

7

Q

A

Q

A

Q

But some of them were standng?

Yes

n front of hm?

Yes.

And would you estmate agan, how many -- and

8 understand it's an estimate, but how many of these people

19 were standing in front of him as opposed to tose sitters?

20

2

A

Q

An estmate would be maybe four or fve

Okay nd we heard testmony from another

22 wtness, so I don't know what you saw, but dd you see any

23 of the persons surroundng hm ever put ther hands on hs

24 bcycle?

3


32/34

1

2

3 hm?

4

5

A

Q

A

Q

Nt that I ecall.

Okay

N.

Okay.

Dd yu eve see them put the hands n

Wuld t be safe t say that t appeaed

6 that they had him suunded and he was t in a psitin

7 t leave?

8

9

10

A

Q

A

Yes.

And seveal f them had skatebads?

I ecall peple havng skatebads.

11 sa hw many thee wee.

I culdnt

12

13

Q I thught the wd "seveal" mght be thwng

yu f a cuve. But thee wee, safe t say, me than

14 ne skatebad amngst ths gup?

15

16

A

Q

Yes.

Okay. And dd they, n fact, appea t be a

1 gup f peple ncludng sme skates f lack f a

18 bette tem?

19 A Yes

20 Q Okay Safe o say a skateboad could be used to

21 infict seius bdily ham if swung at and stuck a

22 pesn?

23

24

A

Q

e

Okay. In fact, as an ffce, f yu wee

32


33/34

1 confroted with somebody with a skaeboard and you thought

they were hostile towards you, you would be on alert, so

3 to speak?

4

5

A

Q

Yes.

Mr Coughli was not wearing protective clothig

6 that night, he just had shorts, a T-shirt style shirt, and

7 a Chicago ha t?

A

Q

A

Yes.

Okay

Yes.

Ad he was outumbered?

MR LESLIE Sorry, Your Honor. I paused there

8

9

1

11

for a moment. I was receiving a call from Las Vegas, but

13 I turned it off

14 BY MR LESLIE

15 Q Now you indicated, I believe, that you handcuffed

16 him partly because he was hesitant to follow your

17 mmad?

18

19

A

Q

Yes

I think we establshed last time when I asked you

0 if he was anoyig, you actually answered more correctly

1 ad ind cated that you were becomig frustrated?

MR. YOUNG: Your onor, I'm going to object to

23 that as far as relevace.

4 MR LESLIE: It goes to his bias, Your Honor

33


34/34

1 M YONG Yur Hnr, and that was - yu

2 allwed that at the mtin t suppress hearing with

3 respect t suppressn. Nw that yu've ruled n that, t

4 desn't have any bearng wth respect t any materal fact

5 n ths charge

6

7

8

M LESLIE: Yur Hnr, I beleve t wll f

yu'll - I mean he already testfed t t All I want

t d s cnfrm that. And I beleve that wth anther

9 couple of questions that Mr. Coughlin has suggested I ask

10 there wll be a least a clrable clam f wtness bas

11 And I thnk the Curt shuld knw whether r nt ths

wtness

THE COT: Okay. I wll verrule the bectn13

14 M LESLIE: Thank yu

15 BY M. LESLIE:

6 Q I beleve that yu, based n hs behavr twards

17 yu, yu became frustrated

Yes18

19

A

Q At sme pnt durng yur encunter and yur

0 interactins with Mr Cughlin, did yu r anther fficer

1 have any discussin r make any statements with regard t

22 arresting him for a felony versus a misdemeanor?

23 M YONG: Agan, Yur Hnr, I'm gng t

24 object to that as relevance.

9 5 12 063341 2025 afternoon portion transcript by lynn stubbs 0204

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