04 On Tathagata-garbha

Disciple: The Tathagata-garbha is real and permanent in absolute truth. How to understand

that view? That is the arguments, right?

Rinpoche: From the point of completion of wisdom, it is.

Disciple: The Tathagata-garbha is not conditioned existent and not causes and conditions.

That can be understood. What is difference between the existence in absolute truth

and that in relative truth? That might be beyond words. Rinpoche ─ That is

interesting! I like this kind of topic! Emptiness doesn’t mean nothing but

“something”. And the “something” is Tathagata-garbha.

Rinpoche: The difference is as far apart as heaven and earth!

Disciple: Thanks! Rinpoche ─ The difference is as far apart as heaven and earth! The only

unchanged is Tathagata-garbha inherently existed in us. The existence in relative

truth is an upside down view of the sentient beings. Is that right?

Rinpoche: The existence in absolute truth is permanent and omnipotent. The existence in

relative truth is illusory and impermanent and changed in every minute and

second!

Disciple: How to find the existence in absolute truth? When the existence in absolute truth is

found, does it help to see through the cause and effect of the world? And it

wouldn’t be deluded and upside down!

Rinpoche: It is not found but “revealed”!

Disciple A: Rinpoche said Tathagata-garbha is not produced by practicing but existent

inherently. I assume that the issue is how to reveal it.

Disciple B: Then how to reveal it? With what methods? Is it very difficult?

Disciple A: A thorough cleaning would be fine?

Disciple B: I assume that Tathagata-garbha is too abstract and not easily understood. Is there

any concrete method to do it?

Disciple A: The method is a good practice like Preliminary Practices, i.e. starting out for

bodhichitta and so on.

Rinpoche, Is that right? On a whole, being a disciple should follow guru’s

Instructions.

Rinpoche: Right! Practicing from the moment, it would get closer and closer to Tathagata-

garbha.

Disciple: In Exoteric Buddhism, Tathagata-garbha is divided by two parts of “essence and

function” while in Esoteric Buddhism, Tathagata-garbha is divided by three parts

of “essence, luminosity and function” among which the “luminosity” is radiance

and reveals all phenomena. Why is there difference on Tathagata-garbha in

Exoteric Buddhism and Esoteric Buddhism?

Rinpoche: The definition on Tathagata-garbha is worked out through observations by each

school. When there are detailed observations there come up with the detailed

explanations. That is the difference. But the Tathagata-garbha that each school

realizes is the same and with no difference. If the realized Tathagata-garbha is

different, that would be frustration. (Smiling)

In reality, not only is there difference between Esoteric Buddhism and Exoteric

Buddhism but also among various traditions in Tibetan areas. But the realization

of Tathagata-garbha is the same and no difference.

From that point of view, there is no difference of schools in real Buddhism but one

Buddha Dharma. The current various schools or sects are created by descendants

themselves.

Disciple: What is the relationship between Tathagata-garbha and bodhichitta? What is the

relationship between relative bodhichitta and absolute bodhichitta?

Rinpoche: Bodhichitta is the radiance of Tathagata-garbha and an integral whole with

Tathagata-garbha. The absolute bodhichitta exists in every living being and

neither extra nor less, no increasing nor decreasing but was obstructed and

prevented from shining through.

The relative bodhichitta is simulating the absolute bodhichitta on compassion,

mercy, joy and detachment. When there is strong relative bodhichitta, it can sweep

up some dust and reveal the absolute bodhichitta.

Disciple: The realization of emptiness is the boundary between the absolute bodhichitta and

the relative bodhichitta. Is that right?

Rinpoche: The realization includes emptiness and the absolute bodhichitta illuminated with

the wisdom and mercy as one unity. There is no clear cut of the absolute

bodhichitta and the relative bodhichitta.

Disciple: What is the relationship between bodhisattva precepts and bodhichitta?

Rinpoche: Bodhisattva precepts lead people into bodhisattva. Bodhisattva is surely provided

with bodhichitta. It can say bodhisattva precepts safeguard bodhichitta.

Disciple: Would You please briefly introduce the concept of “Other-Emptiness”?

Rinpoche: Briefly speaking, “Other-Emptiness” refers to all phenomena except of Tathagata-

garbha. And all phenomena are “Self-Emptiness” The Tathagata-garbha is real and

existent in the absolute truth thus it is called “Other-Emptiness”.

From the view of the stage of Buddha and Bodhisattva, the Tathagata-garbha is

real and not empty in the absolute truth. The Tathagata-garbha is not produced by

practicing nor is made by causes and conditions but inherently existed in each

living being neither extra nor less.

Therefore, the view of practicing of “Other-Emptiness” is to sweep up the dust

of ignorance covered outside the Tathagata-garbha and have the Tathagata-garbha

revealed. When the Tathagata-garbha completely reveals itself, it becomes

Buddha.