seattle statement form o police 2017-219301 ... - spd blotter · dewey: alright, this is detective...

Witness

X

Witness

Form 9.27 Rev. 11/07 of 29

SEATTLE POLICE DEPARTMENT

STATEMENT FORM

GENERAL OFFENSE #

2017-219301 RELATED EVENT#

Date:

May 19th, 2017

Time:

1732 Hours

Place

FIT Office

Statement of: Complainant Witness Victim Officer Other:

Name (Last, First MI)

McNew, Steven A

DOB

Statement Taken By:

Detective Jason Dewey

Serial

7426

Unit

C171A

Transcribed by (Taped/Translated Statements)

Robin Ross

Serial

7878

Unit

C170Y

DEWEY: Alright, this is Detective Jason Dewey of the Seattle Police Department; today’s date is June

19th, 2017 and it is approximately 1732 hours. Uh, this will be the interview, or the following

interview is in regard to incident number: 2017-219301 uh, involving Officer Steve McNew,

serial number 7451. Uh, this incident was reported to have taken place at 6818 67th, 62nd

Avenue Northeast, apartment 4303 on June 19th, 2017 at approximately, I believe the initial

call came out at 0855 hours. Uh, present to-, during today’s interview are the following

individuals uh, starting to my right can you just please say your, your name and acknow-,

recognize that in doing so you’re being recorded.

CORBIN: Steve Corbin with FIT, I acknowledge I’m being recorded.

VERHAAR: Uh, Pete Verhaar and I acknowledge I’m being recorded.

COBB: Karen Cobb, I acknowledge the recording.

MCNEW: Steve McNew, I acknowledge I’m being recorded.

HUGHEY: Benjamin Hughey from SPOG I give consent to be recorded.

BEEMSTER: Uh, Tracy Beemster from OPA, I’m aware of the recording.

HIRJAK: And Steve Hirjak of FIT and I understand I’m being recorded. Officer McNew I wish to

advise you that you are being questioned as part of an official investigation of the Seattle

Police Department. You will be asked questions specifically directed and narrowly related to

the performance of your duties or fitness for office. Are you willing to provide a voluntary

statement regarding this incident?

MCNEW: No.

HIRJAK: As you are not willing to provide a voluntary statement, I order you to answer my questions

and those of the Detectives and Sergeant conducting this interview. If you refuse to answer

questions relating to the performance of your official duties, you will be subject to department

charges which could result in your dismissal from the department. Do you understand?


STATEMENT FORM CONTINUATION SHEET

Statement of: McNew, Steven A

Transcribed by: Robin Ross 7878

Taken by: Detective Jason Dewey 7426

GENERAL OFFENSE #

2017-219301

RELATED EVENT#

Form 9.27 Rev. 10/07 of 29

MCNEW: I do.

HIRJAK: Okay and I forgot to bring in a copy of the Police Officer Bill or Rights, so stand by one sec

while I go grab it. I’ll be back in (unintelligible), no time at all.

DEWEY: Oh, and for the record Lieutenant Hirjak left the room…momentarily.

HIRJAK: Okay, and now I’m providing you with a copy of the Police Officer Bill of Right, I’m gonna

step out of the room and turn over the interview to these folks. Okay?

DEWEY: Alright and for the recording, Lieutenant Hirjak has left the room.

HUGHEY: Before we start the interview, SPOG has a notice to put on the recording. Uh, per the Officers

Bill of Rights, a rest period should be granted upon the request of the officer before the

interview. This rest period was requested for Officer McNew but not granted by the

department. Due to the external factors of period of time, the officer has last had rest and

sleep, plus the stress of this incident and complete lack of rest, which Scientifics studies have

proven aid in the recall of critical stress incidents. We do not believe the officer’s recall of

this event will be complete to the best of the officer’s ability, should they have been afforded

the rest period.

DEWEY: Okay. Thank you. Alright uh, Officer McNew so uh basically we’re gonna being doing, we

call a cognitive interview. It’s an open ended narration of it uh, the purpose of it, we try to get

as, as much information, none of us were there, you were the only one that was there so we

want to get as much information uh, the most accurate and complete recollection of the

incident as possible. Uh, so you know we understand that you can only remember so much

and that things happen very quickly, so if you don’t know the answer to a question, that’s

okay, just say, “I don’t recall or I don’t, don’t remember”. Um just you know, don’t guess.

Uh, if, if I ask you to repeat any questions, it’s not that you did anything wrong, it’s that either

I didn’t hear something or, or maybe it may s-, I didn’t understand how you re-, you said it, so

if I ask you to repeat it, that’s total, that’s totally understandable. So, and the length of the

interview, it takes some time, it will take quite a while um and as far as the detail goes, I’m

mean it, I want you just to, as much detail as you can. Uh, so for example, you know I could

just say I went to Starbucks and I got a cup of coffee, uh, but the detail I’m looking for is, is

for example, so I, I’m, I walked up to the oak tree Starbucks, it’s in the you know, ten-

thousand block of Aurora Avenue North uh, parked on the north side of the building and it’s

on corner to where there’s a door on the north side of the building and a door on the east side

of the building. Uh, both sides of the building on the north and east side are, are glass

windows. Uh, as I w-, approach, there’s a couple of little patio tables outside esp-, in the, at

least in the spring and summer, nobody ever sits out there in the winter. There’s a couple of

patio tables to the right side of the door uh, I walk in the north door and directly to my rights

there’s a small table and to-, next to that there is the stand where they have you know,

creamers and sugars and different straws and stir sticks and everything else for after you’ve

already got your beverage. And then just beyond that, there’s even, there’s a long table uh,

probably about 8 / 10 feet long with I think about 8 chairs; 4 on each side, maybe 5 on each

side so up to 10 chairs. Uh, along the whole east wall, uh next to the window is a bar top

counter uh with several chairs there that just face out the window. So I walk, walked in the






GENERAL OFFENSE #

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RELATED EVENT#

Form 9.27 Rev. 10/07 of 29

north door and I’m, and I kinda walk straight forward ‘cause straight ahead is the bathroom

and then they always have, against the wall where the bathrooms are is where they have you

know, things that you can purchase like cups or bags of coffee or stuff and that’s usually

where the line forms in order to, for you to buy a cup of coffee. Uh, while I’m waiting in line

I can, I can just s-, I can smell the, the aroma of fresh brewed coffee in the air and I can hear

the machine, just the clang, you know and they’re banging the metal into the sink, and they’re,

you can hear the steam and stuff going as they’re making coffee. Um, you know I walked up

and I, I usually always order a, a tall drip with a little bit of room for cream and sugar. Uh, I

was gonna use cash but I only had like 2 dollars and it was a little over that so I had to use my

debit card. Uh, then once you take your order and you pay, you walk over to the right and

there’s the counter where they give you your cup of coffee. Since I got a drip it usually takes

pretty, it’s pretty quick, so they had my coffee ready and then I walked over and I put some

creamer and a couple sugars in it. Uh, that’s the kind of detail I’m looking for, does that make

sense?

MCNEW: Mmhmm.

DEWEY: Okay. Um, so when you’re ready, what I’d like you to do is start before, just before the

incident when you, when you got the call initially uh and, and to the best of your recollection,

just try to explain as detailed as possible from the time you got the, you know the call-out or

just a little before that what you did that day leading up to the event and what happened today.

MCNEW: Okay. Um, before I responded to the call I had been on any, an alarm call with Officer

Schickler over at approximately the thousand block of 68th Street, I believe. Um, we had

handled the alarm, come back out to the car. And then I met up with Officer Schickler, car to

car, and he had mentioned that another unit, possibly from another sector was getting

dispatched to back one of our units, so we looked up the call um, UNION – 3, Officer

Anderson, had been dispatched to the call. And we were trying to figure out if it was a call

that one of us could go, uh, back to clear a separate sector. Um, after a brief discussion

figuring out what the call was, uh, it was a burglary call and there was some discussion about

why a 2nd unit was being dispatched and there was possibly some officer information. So I

looked at the unit that was assigned to back him, which was UNION – 21 and noticed UNION

– 21 was further off and I had a straight shot um, going out to where UNION – 3 was so I

came over radio and I volunteered to clear UNIT – 21 because I was closer, and respond to the

scene. Uh, I drove to the location, I, I’m fairly familiar with that area, we responded to

several calls out that way. I, and when I initially pulled up uh, I checked the addresses of the,

the location is in Magnuson Park, uh, there’s several large buildings down there with

apartments, there’s also town homes, so I, I looked at the address, um, and then I looked at the

boards that are, are placard in front of, uh, I think it’s the northwest corner of the, uh, the

closest building to the entrance and saw that none of the addresses were on there and knew

that there was another address in the back. So I proceeded down a driveway going eastbound

towards Magnuson Park and then there’s a smaller driveway that then turns southbound so I, I

took that and uh, pulled up behind what I located was uh UNION – 3’s car. So after arriving,

UNION – 3 got out of his vehicle, Officer Anderson, he approached my car uh and we had an

initial conversation about what the call was um and, and what was going on as far as the, the

unit or the need for the second officer. Officer Anderson, uh, discussed briefly that he had

looked at a case and said at a previous occasion that the occupant had called police for

assistance and that she had brandished scissors. Um, it was my recollection that I asked him






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Form 9.27 Rev. 10/07 of 29

uh, a couple of questions, uh, about the caution, um, if she had been flagged mental, um, in, in

RMS and, um, he stated that it was just an officer safety caution that the prior incident she had

been placed under arrest. As we approached the, the front doors, we crossed an open court

yard, um, heading south towards the building, uh, and then you come up to what’s

approximately a 3 to 4 story building, uh, with a call box outside and I believe there was even

a brief discussion out there where I asked him a clarifying question, um, about the previous

incident; about whether or not the subject had brandished scissors and he corrected me and

said, “No,” um, not only did she brandish scissors but she had blocked or barred the officers

from leaving. Uh, up to that point there was some confusion in my head. I thought what he

said was that, uh, she had brandished scissors because she wanted to officers to leave. He said,

no, no, no, she was trying to keep them in. Um, and I made some comment about you know,

‘cause he said she was ar-arrested. I made some comment about, you know, kidnapping or

something like that, um, and I told him that we’re not gonna let her get behind us or between

us and the door. After reviewing my video, uh, I realized that there was more conversation by

the car about the, the previous incident to where Officer Anderson had actually told me that

she had begun to, I think he used the word, speak crazy and talk something about her and her

daughter transforming into something, um, I didn’t initially recall that after the incident. Um,

we went up to the call box. Officer Anderson then began to, uh, attempt to call the tenant, uh,

and at that point I was trying to remember, we have a lot of difficulty getting into these

buildings and there’s a code that SHA buildings typically have, so I was trying to recall that,

uh, and then there was an answer at the call box and, uh, the door buzzed, so we, we went

ahead and went on in and there was some discussion. On the floor, I don’t think we knew

what it was, if there was some sort of substance and what we determined were cherries, they

were like red blots on the floor uh but you could also see the pits. So um, there was some

basic small talk about that but, you know, we proceeded up the stairs to where the unit was.

And initially when we responded I thought maybe it was the corner unit, there was a unit in

that building, we responded as an entire sector, uh, where we had a disturbance, so initially

pulling up I said, oh is it the unit with 3 kids um, in which he said yes, but there

misconception there because it was not the one that we had been to before, so we get to the

top of the stairs, I look to the end unit, ‘cause that’s what my recollection for the previous

incident was, and he says no, it’s 4303, um, which when you get to the top of the, the very top

of the stairs, um, there’s a window behind us which faces northbound and then there’s a door,

a fire door, security door. So there’s another level, uh, of security there so you gotta go

through that doorway and you emerge into a hallway and there’s one-unit kind of tucked into

the corner and then the very next unit just slightly to the right, uh, is centered. Um, Officer

Anderson knocked on the door. I was slightly off-set like I typically do when another

officer’s, uh, knocking on a door, for officer safety. Uh, door opens and Officer Ander-,

Anderson exchanges a initial greeting and asks if we can come in, uh, to which the occupant

says, “yes.” Uh, so we’re invited in and initially you step in and the, the units somewhat dark.

Um, you come in and the entry way is maybe a 3 by 4 square before you’re into kitchen,

living room, hallway, and it’s, it’s pretty immediate. And I saw a couple of very small

children on the floor, uh, not in distress, just crawling around the floor. I uh, I noticed the d-,

apartment was in disarray um, there was old food laying about, clothes. Uh, initially I, I

stepped in and, while kind of observing this, saw the children and, um, you know waved at the

children, tried to alleviate any, you know ‘cause the kids are staring at you at the point. Uh,

but they didn’t seem to be in distress, they were just sitting on the floor. And, uh, Officer

Anderson began to discuss the event, uh, the possible burglary with the, uh, the subject. She

was answering his questions, I think she was wearing a, like a black down coat or a black

overcoat of some sort and, uh, he was asking her all the, all the standard questions you’d ask






GENERAL OFFENSE #

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RELATED EVENT#

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in a burglary. Uh, she began to describe how she had gone out to the store and she had

possibly left the door unlocked, uh, that her X-Box and her PlayStation had been taken, um,

and at that point, when she said the door was unlocked I stepped back and I, I took a look at

the door-jam, uh, for any signs of forced entry and I believe I asked her, um, if the door was

left unlocked. I think she even stepped in my direction, said, “yeah, so I might have,” uh, and

kinda pointed to the door-jam, said, “someone you know got their way in,” uh, which isn’t

uncommon with unlocked doors in multiple person units. Uh, so we went about the

conversation and, at some point, she asked us if we wanted to go see where the other unit was

taken from. So she led us down a hallway which was dark, there’s no, there was no natural

light or no a light illuminating it and it was dirty, um, even in the initial doorway I think there

was, uh, obstructions around, debris, and we followed her down, uh, and at this point I’m

watching her, I’m trying to observe, you know we’ve got the previous call but I’m trying to

observe to my satisfaction if this is just somebody reporting something, and up to that point I,

I thought it was, she was answering questions, she led us into the back, she pointed to where

uh there was a TV set, uh the room again in disarray. Uh, bowls of half-eaten food that

looked, you know several days old and I, I took a moment to kinda take it in, to kinda see

where a, a unit may have been, at that point she led us back to the living room and Officer

Anderson, uh, continued to get her personal information which she provided and the kids

were, um, going about on the floor and I believe that, that point I had taken, it’s, I mean

you’ve seen the unit. It’s hard to describe. When you step in the front door of this, the doors

swings open into what would be the entry way, the door, if I recall, um, swings in and swings

to the left and your entry way is essentially the, the path of the door and then you’ve got

inside a kitchen; there’s a counter-top and then it goes immediately into the living room or

down the hallway. Um, at this point my mind was working around um the condition of the

apartment and I don’t recall uh at the point, it’s been a long day, but there was a question as

to, was there anything else that these people went in-, into. So when she had taken us out to

the living room she pointed to a trash bag, dark colored trash bag that was on the couch and

my thinking behind this was there’s no damage to the door-jam, 2) very expensive items had

been taken and so I was, I was in an evaluation of “are we dealing with a burglary?” I was in

that mindset, investigating a burglary and the 2 items that were missing just didn’t quite fit,

that’s why I a-, why the question was asked, was anything else gone through. Um, and she

pointed to a bag with clothes and said, yeah, they, they went through that thought it you know,

it had something in it. And at this point, he, he, Officer Anderson’s talking to her, she had

reached into a pocket, nothing alarming, she’s a, a reported victim, nothing that I would over

react to. Um, and there was no, you know as an officer, when people reach in their pockets ,

you always take notice, but it didn’t seem like there was any intent behind anything. She

reached into her pocket you know with the one hand, hand came out, not big deal. Um, so

she’s standing at the other side of the bar and I believe I’m on the side of the kitchen and

Officer Anderson is very close proximity to me and I’m looking around the kitchen at the

condition, there, it looked like there was a meatloaf that might have been 3 weeks old, like ½

eaten on the counter. Um, the kitchen was in complete disarray and there, there’s kids rolling

around and I’m just trying to take in the situation and kind of assess what’s going on and then

very quickly and again, I don’t recall, it’s been a long day, it w-, happened very fast, but a

knife gets produced. Um, and then, what was a victim who was calm in her demeanor, who

was answering questions, um, in a way that didn’t make me feel she was plotting something,

she was just answering questions. You ask date of birth, she was answering. You know, I’m

hearing this going on with Officer Anderson as I’m taking in the scene and then, all of a

sudden there’s a knife and she’s got visib-, there’s visible emotion, like you know her face is

grimaced, and I didn’t recall, I, I knew she had said something and I, I could see the emotion






GENERAL OFFENSE #

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on her face and she was holding the knife, but up until I was able to review my video, I, I

couldn’t remember what she was saying and, in the video, I could at least hear, you know, she

said, she was, she was saying something and I remember hearing, you know, that she said the

word “Motherfucker” and then I didn’t recall what I. I knew I drew my gun, I mean it was the

immediate reaction, you know the knife was produced, it’s, it’s the “Oh my God” moment,

you know I, I draw my gun, but I couldn’t remember the commands, I couldn’t remember

what I said to her. Um, or if I got on radio at that point after listening to my video once again

um, I was yelling at her to um “Stop”, I believe it was. I, I yelled at her like 3 or 4 times and

I, I think I got progressively louder and at some point I was able to get on radio and verbalize

that she had knives and that we needed help. At that point, I’m behind the bar, separated from

Officer Anderson and she’s across from us and she goes back, like she’s gonna throw this

knife, uh, again, her face just a lot of emotion, a lot of what appeared to be anger, um, and

she’s got this knife and we’re yelling at her, and she draws her arm back and I’m thinking,

shit, you know she’s about to throw this thing and she’s, maybe, the distance across this table

and there’s, there’s like a counter-top height so she’s clearly you know seeing over it and I’m

not very small. So I, I bent down expecting to, you know, feel this knife any second and I

don’t and I pop back up and she’s, starts making her way towards the intersection of where

you walk into the living room where it kind of bottlenecks at the end of the bar top, and she

starts going towards that section and I’m starting to think in my head, you know when she was

on the other side, you know the question is, you know, do you run out? Officer Andersons by

the door, do you run out? And I remember thinking you know even in the speed of time

there’s 2 little children at her feet and she’s so visibly upset and agitated with these knives, I, I

just couldn’t, there was I, I remember thinking the kids were there and whatever brief thought

of you know, going towards the door was, was not possible. I, I couldn’t go. Um, even after

ducking, even after thinking she was gonna throw the knife at me. And so she starts, very

quickly, I think that’s when I got on radio and she makes very quickly for that opening and I

thought…she went, she moved into the opening and I, from my perspective her attention was

now on Officer Anderson who was several feet to my side, I, and I don’t believe I could see

him anymore because there’s a, when you go in that entry way in the kitchen, there’s, there’s

a little bit there that if he was stepped back far enough, I knew he was there, I could hear, I

knew he was in that location but I couldn’t see him. So she went towards that. So between

the time of you know, asking for help, she went towards that. And at this point, I didn’t know

when it happened because I know initially I saw a knife, but when I called it, reviewed my

video, when I called out over radio, I said that she had knives. So she had these knives and

she gets into that gap and then I realize where I’m at and I’m stuck in a kitchen where I’ve got

2 feet behind me and there’s nowhere to go and I, I knew she was talking and I thought she

said, “Come on” or something like that and she starts closing that gap to where she’s gonna

cut off my, my avenue of escape and now I’m 3 feet from someone with 2 knives. And at

that point fearing for what was about to happen, what she would do to me um, being stuck in

that spot, I fired my handgun.

After firing, I, I don’t know, I don’t recall how many shots, but I fired my handgun and I, in

my mind I remember hearing shots coming from where Officer Anderson was. I don’t recall

seeing him but I remember hearing shots. I remember firing in pretty rapid succession but

then you know when I’m stopping, just still hearing like the register of a, maybe a handgun

round, um, and she hit the floor, she, I didn’t see her movement, but when she landed on the

floor she landed face down. Uh, and I’m yelling out to, to Anderson at this point, um, asking

Jason if he’s okay, and he says he’s okay and, um, one of the little babies crawls out from

behind and right on top of her…her…upper body, you know resting his head against her.






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Um, and then another kid pops out of a bedroom, that we, we had no idea there was any other

people in, in the apartment, and he pops out and I’m thinking, “Oh my God”, his mom’s you

know, on the floor, you know dying, and I, I yelled at him, I told him get back, you know get

back inside, I think I even said, please get back inside and he ducked back in. And at that

point I think I was trying to get radio out and I believe I said uh, called-out that said um…that

the suspect was do-, or that shots had been fired, uh, at some point I was able to get to radio

that the officers were okay but there were minors on the premise. Um, and so all the things

started going through my head about happens at a shooting scene, what, what’s next and I’m

seeing her, um, I think at that point I holstered, Anderson had her, um, and I believe I put on

gloves ‘cause I was momentarily thinking you know, do I start rendering aid? And we’ve got

this little baby on top of her, so…I said something to Anderson about stepping up, Uh, I

reached down, I grabbed the baby, um, and so I had the one baby in my arm and when he

stepped up, I stepped around her, and visually saw, I couldn’t pick up the other baby, I didn’t

want to separate from Anderson at that point, I wanted to try and stay together. I could see the

other little baby was around the corner, uh, still somewhat calm, I don’t recall the baby crying.

So I had the one baby, um, and then the priority from there was to try and figure out if the kid

in the bedroom is okay, if there’s anyone else. I asked Officer Anderson to yell, uh, to the kid

and I don’t remember, I, I remember him yelling but I don’t remember any report back. So at

that point I decided to…get with Officer Anderson, I asked him about radio traffic, I kept

bonking and bonking and bonking. So I stepped, I asked him if he was okay. Um, from his

position I stepped, I believe I opened that fire door that I had mentioned before you go in and

I went towards the north facing window, tried to get as close to it as I could to get a, radio out

and I believe at that time is when I was able to radio out that, um, where the building was, that

it was in the back of the location ‘cause it’s a confusing location. Um, shortly thereafter I had

married back up with Officer Anderson, we were standing by, I heard someone come up and it

was Officer Schickler, and I told him we got minors in there, we need to get em’ out. Um,

Officer Schickler came in, he was able to get the small infant that was still in the, um, living

room. And then he went to the bedroom and I had told him to, to have them shelter in place.

I told him, I wanted him to figure out if there was anyone else in there, um, based on where

the shooting happened I, I wanted to know if everyone was okay. And he found the, what

turned out to be an 11-year-old, so they started coming out and mom’s still on the floor,

Anderson’s still covering her. I yelled at Schickler to cover his eyes, so he didn’t have to see

it. And Officer Schickler guided him out I, I don’t recall if the child had his hand on his eyes

or if Officer Schickler did. And then I grabbed a hold of the child and I started walking him

out the door and Officer Schickler. The little boy asked, he said he didn’t want to leave and I

said, we’re not going anywhere, and then you know Officer Schickler said, I’m taking him

downstairs. And I said, go with the officer and Officer Schickler went down. A couple

minutes later he came back up and he realized that I was still holding another child, so he took

that child and took them downstairs, uh, and then when he came back, he came back with 2

more officers, um, and at that point I directed them to check for any other possible victims,

any other people in the apartment, to clear it. They did, uh, and then they began rendering aid

and I, I got on radio, I was asking “where’s the medics?” and I was told they were standing

by, I said, “No, send ‘em in”.

And then from that point on, um, I grabbed Anderson out, I told him to take a breath, holster

his gun, I told him, I said, “They’re gonna have questions”, I said “From this point on we

don’t, we don’t talk about it, come with me”. And we went down stairs and other officers

starting pouring in and, um, and handling it. And we met up with our Sergeant, and there was

confusion over, we tried to get a guild rep, uh, we were read the public safety information,






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um, and then we stood by…and then at some point we were directed inside. Crowd started

developing out so they were able to clear an office and we, uh, waited inside until our

representation, uh, arrived. And, uh, Assistant Chief Tarrant arrived and ordered us all to turn

off our video, and at that time, we made that happen. I don’t think I have anything further to,

to add.

DEWEY: Okay. Okay, uh, so, I’d like to go back, um, to the point where you, you’re, you’re in the

kitchen area I believe, correct? Like kind of just off into the kitchen area there, uh, you know

you’re looking, you, you mentioned there some old meatloaf, you kinda assessing the

situation and then you see she has a knife. If you can hyper-focus on that moment, can you

describe, I mean do you re-, to the best of your recollection try to think of how did the knife

get produced, where, you know things like that.

MCNEW: Given the way this day has gone, kind of, you know, the, the length of time, I, I don’t feel

comfortable. I know, I know it’s in here, I know it’s in my memory, it’s just, it, it happened

so fast and it’s just…at this point with the stress and the length of the day, I, I just can’t, I

can’t accurately say it, or confidently say…

DEWEY: Okay.

MCNEW: …how it was produced.

DEWEY: Okay. Um, so then we’ll skip just a little bit ahead then, um, note this is audio recording and

not video so you, you made some hand gestures…

MCNEW: Okay.

DEWEY: …. saying she’s going back with the knife. Can you describe what you mean by that?

MCNEW: So…after the knife was produced, she was initially on the other side. I was on the kitchen

side behind the counter, she was on the other side. And we were yelling at her. I remember

having my gun up and, um, from what I recall, what I’d seen was that after she produced the

knife, and at some point she came overhand and I’m…five feet away from her at this point.

In my mind when she came overhand with the knife, my belief was her intention was to throw

it at me. I ducked down so I don’t recall if she followed through with the motion. I don’t

remember h-, like I said, I was expecting to feel it. I didn’t know, you know, uh, if it would

just be something where she threw the knife and it just hit me, I didn’t know at that point, in

my head I’m, I’m wondering if this is something where she’s gonna throw it and its gonna

stick but I, I go down and I’m expecting to feel it and I didn’t and that’s when I popped back

up. And that’s when, you know like I said, there’s the thought of, do I haul ass for the door?

But there’s 2 little kids. So when I say I thought she was gonna throw it, that’s why it’s

‘cause there was, she brought the knife up. To me the only interpretation was that she was

gonna attempt to throw it, ‘cause she couldn’t get to my physically without coming up and

over the bar.

DEWEY: Okay.






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MCNEW: Or all the way around.

DEWEY: Okay. And so when she goes up with the knife and it’s up over her head, is the blade, do you

recall which way the blade was facing?

MCNEW: I don’t.

DEWEY: Okay.

MCNEW: As soon as the arm went up my only thought was, it, it’s hard to, to articulate this, but she’s

on the other side, she’s very animated at this point. She’s made it very clear she’s got this

knife, she’s yelling at us, her face is angry, you know just, I can’t describe it any other way

but there wa-, there was emotion in her face. She didn’t just have a straight look about her,

this wasn’t a calm demeanor, you know her face was, was grimaced…and she was stuck on

the other side of this thing. So I had a, I had a barrier there for a moment. So when it came

up the only thing in my head is, she can’t get to me, she’s gonna throw this thing at me and

that’s why I, I ducked and I ducked, I think with my face away from her, you know

anticipating the blade coming.

DEWEY: Okay. So then you mentioned she starts, uh, walking towards, uh, the intersection between

where you and Officer Anderson were and she’s about 3 feet away and you mentioned at that

point she had 2 knives…

MCNEW: I don’t know at what point I recognized she had 2 knives, but at some point I recognized she

had 2 knives in her hand. When the initial incident occurred, um, there’s a moment in there

where you go from a very normal contact to the “Oh Shit” kinda moment. And it was very

much that it’s you know, at one, one moment you’re kinda surveying and thinking maybe

there’s you know more issues going on here to “Holy Shit, she’s got a knife in her hand”.

And that’s what that was, the intersection in between of where did that come out, right now is,

is too fuzzy, it’s just been too long of a day to, to really focus on that, but at some point there

was a knife. And so I don’t know if it’s because it’s the first hand I saw or what, but I knew

there was a knife and I saw it and then at some point, very quickly, I realized that there was 2

knives. I don’t know if it was after I thought she tried to throw one at me, or thought that’s

what her intention was, to coming back up and then seeing, now that I’m looking at her again

and seeing that there’s 2 knives.

DEWEY: Okay. So she comes up into this, this intersection and, and, and you, you made the decision to

fire your weapon. At that point in time if you can try to focus on your surroundings and, and

do you, can you describe what you, what that looked like at that point in time?

MCNEW: At the point between when she tried to, when I believe she was trying to throw the knife at

me, to coming back up and, and seeing that she was still fully engaged and that she was

moving over. She was coming towards the end of the, I think she even made it past the end of

the counter. But it was this, in real time and in happened in seconds, in your mind you’re






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thinking like you know, I don’t want to have to do this, you know you’re, you’re thinking

about, okay there’s kids, should I be trying to make my escape? My partner’s over here…and

very quickly if she takes another step, not only am I trapped, but now I’ve got my partner

standing right behind me. And so there wa-, there was that moment in time where you don’t

want it to happen, you want this to keep evolving to, to where you can see that’s going even

though it’s just split seconds, but these things are going through your head; it’s that she’s

coming around that corner, she’s initially looking at him, but now I’ve got a problem to where

now she’s got unevaded access to me with knives, and my partner potentially is gonna be in

direct crossfire which means my options at that point are to, I can’t shoot at my partner, you

know and there’s now real options that way. My only option at that point was gonna be to try

and defend myself somehow against someone wielding knives. And so when it got to that

point, even though I was, you’re sitting there going in your mind, you know you’re, you’re

hoping that this’ll stop, you’re hoping that this isn’t gonna go any further. She finally gets to

that point and it’s like there’s no other choice, either I do this now or she’s gonna get me or

I’m in an impossible situation and so at that point it wasn’t, it switched from initially you

know kinda taking him like “Holy crap”, she’s got these knives too, I can’t take off ‘cause

these kids are right here, what’s gonna happen if we leave to, she’s moving towards this

intersection where my partner’s at to very clearly like, now it’s just me. You know, he’s out

the door, you know he doesn’t have to worry about it, now she’s got me cornered and I wasn’t

willing to take my chances to see what she could to me with that and so at that time, that’s

when I fired.

DEWEY: Okay. Uh…so, I’d like you to take a little bit even further back than, you mentioned it’s a

lock-out building, uh, that you buzzed the complainant or the subject?

MCNEW: I didn’t do it, Anderson buzzed. I don’t know if he buzzed it by complainant name or by unit,

but uh, Officer Anderson can answer any questions related to…who was on the other end…

DEWEY: Sure.

MCNEW: …or he was attempting to buzz.

DEWEY: Okay. And then now, I’m not trying to jump around but I’m just trying to you know, clarify a

few things here so, uh, you mentioned as you were trying to get the kids out that your radio

was bonking.

MCNEW: Correct.

DEWEY: And I understand what you mean by that but…

MCNEW: (Unintelligible).

DEWEY: …can you describe what bonking means?

MCNEW: So, uh, when you go to activate you radio, I carry a, I’ve got a little lapel mic that has a button

on the side of it and essentially what that means is that you press the, the button on your, your






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mic and…you either get a, a bonking, an off noise, um it, I can’t describe the noise, but it, it’s

a noise that’s not the same as when the radio accepts that you’ve got an open line of traffic.

So, in, in these buildings, these larger buildings sometimes what ends up happening is because

of reception due to wherever you’re at, you hit your radio and it bonks you, it gi-, gives you

this audible tone that says you’re not getting out. Um, essentially the biggest problem with

that at that point is we’ve just been involved with a shooting, we’ve got children we need to

you know secure uh and possibly render aid to. Uh, and we’re behind a fire door in addition

to, we’re behind a locked door downstairs. And so at that points it’s, even though Anderson is

then left, and, and what I feel with the suspect down, a reasonably safe location where he can

respond to a threat, the bigger issue here is we need to get extra people in here, we need to get

medics in here, we need to get the cavalry coming. Um, so not wanting to get too far from

him, my best option that I felt at the time was to get next to a window and I believe that’s

when I finally got out after attempting several times, I think I asked Officer Anderson, “Are

you getting out?”, and I don’t know if he attempted or if he just said no but then I, I knew I

had to…leave my partner momentarily to try and get communication.

DEWEY: Okay. Do you have any questions for him? Okay, uh, what I’d like you to do at this time is if

you can, there’s some dry erase markers back here and…

VERHAAR: (Unintelligible).

DEWEY: Sorry Sarge, go ahead.

VERHAAR: Um, I want to ask a couple of questions, uh, you said several times that, uh, you know, you’re

in fear of what she could do to you. Uh, can you just, what, what could she do to you? What

was going through your mind? What could, what were you in fear of?

MCNEW: Based on my training, including education as to the damage knives can inflict, even smaller

knives, I knew that the reactionary gap for her to get to me and for me to defend myself was

very small at that point. And even if I was able to somehow…go to a position where I could

get my arms up and protect my neck or other vital spots, um, stabbing, slashing, um, even

slashing of the arms, the neck, the head, uh, can result in disabling injury. She gets to my

face, uh, and stabs me in the face, cuts me in the face, uh, blood loss alone could, could blind

me and make me further susceptible. Um, so when she was at the point to where I felt she

could have me trapped in that kitchen, my fear is that she could kill me.

VERHAAR: Okay. Um, you, um, after, after firing the gun, you said Anderson had her, can you ju-, can

you say what that means, (unintelligible).

MCNEW: Yeah, so um, as far as tactics and there was a, uh, i-, if I may add, um, during the speed of the

incident, I believed Anderson, and I don’t know if this is true or not, I believe in the past that

he has carried a Taser. And during the time to where she, I felt she was attempting to throw

the knife at me, um, in moving, in that brief second, I believe I yelled to Anderson, Taser, uh,

even though I know it’s not within policy to Tase somebody when you’ve only got 2 officers.

Uh, getting to the point of he had her covering, um, I know it’s not within policy, uh, at that

point I was just looking for any last ditch effort to slow her down. Um, now as to what you

asked for, he had her, Officer Anderson was in a position at that point I believe of advantage.






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She was laying down on her face, um, and he was approximately 6 to 7 feet away. He had his

handgun still aimed at her, so that if she presented a further threat, he could neutralize any,

any further threat. So when I say he had her, I had already holstered at that point, I was

counting on him for lethal cover on her should she rise up, uh, for any reason and present any

further threat to either us or the children.

VERHAAR: Okay. And then also um, you talked about the knives and her having knives in her hands, um,

how did she have these knives in her hand, if you can you know kind of visualize it and

verbalize to us how she was holding these knives. Um, by you know, by the handles, by the

blades, by the…

MCNEW: To the best of my recollection she was holding the knives by the handles. Also to the best of

my recollection, when she reached the point at which I decided to discharge my firearm, I

believe she had the knives like this.

VERHAAR: (Unintelligible).

MCNEW: Which is indicating, uh, blades forward, elbows, uh, or arms bent at the elbows, uh, presenting

the blades in a forward fashion.

VERHAAR: Okay. I’m sorry to interrupt you…

DEWEY: No, thanks Sarge. Uh, okay, so now what I’d like you to do, if you can, uh, is there’s some

dry-erase markers back here, if you could to the best of your recollection and, and I

understand you might not be an artist, but draw just a sketch of the scene, so that we can, you

know again, paint the picture for us because we weren’t there. Okay? And, and just for, like

to remind you is that we are uh, we are audio not video recording, so if you…

MCNEW: Okay.

DEWEY: …you know, as best you can if you can, uh, narrate, narrate it, that would be great.

MCNEW: Okay.

DEWEY: I just want to make sure that is not a permanent marker, correct? Okay.

MCNEW: No it isn’t.

DEWEY: ‘Cause I think there have been some mixed up there before.

MCNEW: If you’ll give me a moment, I’m just gonna try and get the general schematic down.

DEWEY: Absolutely.






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MCNEW: Alright. So arrow pointed down is indicating north.

DEWEY: And then if, oh sorry, go ahead.

MCNEW: What do you need?

DEWEY: I was just gonna say, when you’re ready, uh, if you want to, for, for people if you want to use

different colors, that would make probably…

MCNEW: Okay.

DEWEY: …just a little easier, but go ahead, continue with your…

MCNEW: So, for the initial lay-out of the apartment is, once you get up to the top of the stairs, you

roughly on the north side, or north facing side of the building. Um, you go down a short

hallway or an area, landing area, and you got another door. Once you get past that door, you

enter a larger hallway. So this would be our movement southbound, through the building.

You go through the, the exterior door to the hallway, you now enter the hallway. There’s a

unit, you turn immediately left, which would be your eastside, that’s uh unit uh 4101, if I

remember right. Uh, the subject unit was 4303, so it might have been 4301, 4303. Um, when

the door opens, and you’ll have to forgive me on the length of this, or the width of this

hallway, but the door opens and then you immediately step into this landing area. So, the

subject alleged that there was a bag, um, so just the things she alleged were taken, there was a

TV here, she alleged that there was stolen item here, that there was a bag that was gone

through here and this is the bedroom she took us back and she pointed out to a TV that was

roughly in that location. Um, (unintelligible),

DEWEY: Can you label those for me please?

UNKNOWN: Sure

DEWEY: I know it’s kind of tough, but…

MCNEW: So, at the time of the incident, uh, as I described it before we initially came in, she invited us

in, uh, she was in this general vicinity when she was talking to Officer Anderson. She

initially said that the X-Box was taken, that there was a PlayStation taken, and at some point

she offered to show us. Uh, the door was here, I inspected the jam, that was part of that initial

conversation where she said she stepped out, just left it unlocked. Uh, she brought us back,

we, I believe let her lead…and we followed and she showed us where the PlayStation was

taken from. She then escorted us back out, I believe I was behind her and she stopped, I’m

gonna use blue to indicate her, let’s see here, I’ll try and keep this straight if I can, so…when

this interview was completing, I believe she was roughly here. So that’s gonna be the subject.

Officer Anderson, I’ll use green, I believe was right in this vicinity. And I had just stepped

past him, right about here, ‘cause I was examining the remnants of the kitchen. Then we, let’s

see…the children, you had, uh, the 2 small children, roughly in this area. And then at the






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time, we didn’t realize it until after the shooting, that there was a subject in here. I don’t

remember this bedroom door being opened when we had gone down.

DEWEY: Okay.

MCNEW: What further?

DEWEY: So, um, if you could mark where you, there, put yourself where you think you were when

you…fired your weapon.

MCNEW: Okay.

DEWEY: And where she was when you fired your weapon.

MCNEW: So I’m gonna move this dot, to the best of my recollection, by the time I fired my weapon, I

was here…

DEWEY: Okay.

MCNEW: …and she was…at this point advanced to roughly this location here, and I fired in this

direction.

DEWEY: Okay. Can you label uh the subject and yourself?

VERHAAR: Can we actually have you put yourself back to where you originally were? And then do a

dotted line to where you ended up?

DEWEY: Thanks, yeah.

MCNEW: So, initially I believe I was right about here and she produced the uh, the knife and then at that

point where she attempted to throw or, where I felt she attempted to throw the knife at me, I

was ducked down right about here. Then she was in this vicinity here and she then moved

around this way, I ended up roughly in that position there…roughly.

DEWEY: Okay.

MCNEW: I don’t remember the distance, I remember that one of the things in my mind was that she was

about to break this plane, so I was in this vicinity here, it’s a very small kitchen.

DEWEY: Uh, can you label yourself then? And the green one that you said you believe is…

MCNEW: At the time when I discharged my firearm, I could not see Officer Anderson, from the report,

or what I felt was the report, I felt he was in this vicinity here. ‘Cause I couldn’t visually see

him at that point.






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DEWEY: Okay.

MCNEW: And upon subsequent, you know when he was standing at the door, I believe he was, when I,

he had cover of the subject who was down, he was in this vicinity right here.

DEWEY: Okay. Um…okay if you could write “Not to scale” and then just your signature and serial

number…and date.

MCNEW: Anything else?

DEWEY: Uh, no you, that’s good you can take a seat. Thank you. Okay. So…so you m-, so you’re

saying or you mentioned earlier that your s-, you’re listening, she’s just kinda giving the, the

general questions or answers to a burglary report, um…did you, was there a point…where you

noticed any d-, change in her demeanor?

MCNEW: No. Not until, not until the knife was produced, and like I said, I, I, it’s been too long of a day

and I can’t recall the specific of where the knife came from. But up until the knife, I

mean…at the point the knife was produced I’m looking at the kitchen and Anderson’s getting

like, in my head I feel like he’s wrapping this up, like this, this things almost done. When you

go on a burglary report, especially one that’s a vague as this, you’re getting you know, your

identifying the property they say was taken. You identify the way that they say, you know,

the suspect possibly gained entry. I believe the question to, “Do you have any idea who might

have done this?”, was asked and when you get to the point of, you’re just kinda crossing off

the, what’s your phone number, date of birth, that kind of stuff, in my head this things about

over. You know, we’re gonna head out of here and then it’s just off, like I said, her, her

demeanor was calm, you know we’re asking her questions and you know as police officers,

you know, you guys know that when you’re asking someone questions, people aren’t able to

focus on, on too many things at once. When you’re asking questions where they have to

recall detail, typically the people that you’re worried about fighting and/or running or thinking

about that and they’re, they’re distracted. I didn’t get that from her. She was answering her

date of birth; she was answering her phone number. Her details on the items and what not

wasn’t great. But even to a question of, “Was there anything else gone through”, there was an

answer. You know if wasn’t something like she was sitting here trying to make up something,

I mean she had an answer to that. Um, so up until the point where this weapon appeared and

we’re in that mode of, you know, this is happening, I’m thinking this is an interview that’s

about done, he’s gonna go do the paperwork on this and we’re going home. You know, that’s

it. So yeah, uh, as far as her behavior leading up to that, no I, at that point I didn’t feel that we

had anything other than what we had on face value, so I’m reporting some sort of burglary

other than what we had on face value. So we’re reporting some sort of burglary and that was

it.

DEWEY: Do you have any questions?

CORBIN: No.

DEWEY: Sarge, do you have any more?






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VERHAAR: No.

DEWEY: Alright. Do you carry a back-up weapon?

MCNEW: I do not.

DEWEY: Okay. What type of firearm was used during this incident?

MCNEW: Um, full size 9-mil, double stack Glock, I think it’s a 17 is the, the actual model.

DEWEY: Okay. And is it a personally owned or department owned weapon?

MCNEW: It’s a department issued weapon.

DEWEY: And have you received training to use this type of weapon?

MCNEW: I have.

DEWEY: If so, when and by whom?

MCNEW: Uh, the department has trained me, uh, at a minimum I believe, 8 hours a year for the 9 years

I’ve been in service. Uh, I went to the Washington State Academy which, I believe is roughly

720 hours, and I don’t recall what portion of that is spent at the range, but a significant portion

is. I’ve also, uh, received additional training in um low light, ‘cause I carry a weapon

mounted light so I’ve also done that which included qualifications and practice firing. I’ve

done at least 2 sessions of that.

DEWEY: Okay. Did you change or alter the condition of this weapon after the shooting?

MCNEW: I did not.

DEWEY: Uh, you mentioned you have a weapon mounted light and you went through a weapon

mounted light, (unintelligible), i-, is that a department approved modification to your weapon.

MCNEW: It is, uh, it’s department approved, the equipment is mine, the training was provided by the

department.

DEWEY: Uh, what is the type and retention level of your holster?

MCNEW: I don’t know off hand.

DEWEY: Okay.






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MCNEW: It’s a department approved model.

DEWEY: Uh, did you use, was you weapon mounted light activated during this?

MCNEW: I don’t recall.

DEWEY: Okay. So, after she first produced the knife you said you drew your weapon. How did you

have your weapon? How were you holding your weapon?

MCNEW: Uh, my weapon was up and addressed on the subject. Uh, I presented my weapon in the

trained fashion to where…the barrel was pointing at the subject. I had both hands firmly on

it.

DEWEY: Okay. And what was your target area?

MCNEW: Center-mass.

DEWEY: And did you obtain a sight picture?

MCNEW: Not that I can recall.

DEWEY: Uh, approximately how close were you, to the subject, when you fired?

MCNEW: About 6 foot.

DEWEY: Did you have cover or concealment?

MCNEW: Not at that point.

DEWEY: And I know we’ve already discussed that.

MCNEW: Yeah, that’s fine.

DEWEY: And…what was your back-drop?

MCNEW: Um, dry-wall.

DEWEY: Uh, were you moving when you fired?

MCNEW: I don’t believe so.

DEWEY: After, or when you fired, did you assess after you, after you fired?






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MCNEW: Yeah, I’m, I delivered the initial rounds, I saw the subject drop, and I ceased fire.

DEWEY: And do you know where the subject was struck?

MCNEW: I don’t.

DEWEY: Did you experience any weapon malfunctions during the shooting?

MCNEW: No.

DEWEY: Did you reload, change your magazines or alter the condition of your weapon?

MCNEW: No.

DEWEY: Do you believe you had any alternatives to using force at the time of the incident?

MCNEW: No.

DEWEY: And why not?

MCNEW: At the point where I decided to use force, as I explained before, the subject had unabated

access to me, to my person, uh, and she was armed. I didn’t feel that there was any

other…reasonable alternative.

DEWEY: Alright. Uh, was your vehicle equipped with a COBAN system?

MCNEW: It was.

DEWEY: Did you do a pre-shift condition check?

MCNEW: I did.

DEWEY: Uh, was the COBAN system working?

MCNEW: Correct.

DEWEY: And was the COBAN system activated during this incident?

MCNEW: It was…prior to the incident.

DEWEY: And how did you activate your COBAN system?

MCNEW: I believe I pushed the button on the back of the camera.






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DEWEY: Uh, so I, I understand you mentioned in your, in your statement so far that you did review

your video, did the, did the video change your perception or memory of this incident?

MCNEW: No.

DEWEY: And can you describe the circumstance in which you reviewed the video?

MCNEW: Uh, I reviewed it here in your office. Um, I was afforded the opportunity, I logged into a

department computer and reviewed the incident from the, uh, time that I arrived and met with

Officer Anderson until I believe I exited the building…afterwards.

DEWEY: Okay. And aside from your COBAN video, did you view any other video related to this

incident?

MCNEW: I have not.

DEWEY: And I apologize, I know you’ve already kind of described this a little bit. What were the

details of the call?

MCNEW: Um, I don’t know the CAD details, like I said uh, in my initial assessment was just to 1) take

care of our sector, to clear any non-sector units. All I knew is that it was…a burglary, uh, in

that some information, officer’s safety information, uh, made dispatch fell the necessity to

have another officer go along.

DEWEY: Can you describe the subject?

MCNEW: Um, African American, approximately 30 years old, 5’5”, um, she was wearing a coat but

appeared to have a somewhat slight build. At 5’5”, I’d say 120 pounds, maybe less.

DEWEY: Okay. And did you observe any evidence of impairment?

MCNEW: No.

DEWEY: And how did your size compare to the subjects?

MCNEW: We’ll I’m 6’2”, 250 pounds, so I’d say I’m a little larger than her.

DEWEY: So y-you mentioned in your statement that you had said, you had given her some commands.

And what were those commands again?

MCNEW: Upon reviewing my video, I believe I was telling her to “Stop”.

DEWEY: Okay. Uh, and did she appear to understand your commands?






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MCNEW: I don’t know. I don’t know. She, she wasn’t stopping so, to that effect she wasn’t complying

with them. I don’t know if she understood them or not.

DEWEY: And do you, did you or, or Officer Anderson, do you recall, giving her any commands after

you used force?

MCNEW: I don’t believe so.

DEWEY: And what de-escalation tactics or techniques, or was it feasible at the time of the incident?

MCNEW: At the time of the incident, I don’t feel that there, as I explained before, um, with the

progression of the situation, I, I didn’t feel that there was any other tactics that could have

been used. We tried, uh, verbal commands, but I, even besides the verbal commands, I

initially used the kitchen counter as an obstacle, um, which initially worked until like I said,

um, the option to retreat, I didn’t feel was there. I don’t feel in good conscious I could leave

those 2 little children. Um, I didn’t know about the 3rd one but certainly these little kids on

the, the living room floor alone, I couldn’t just run out. Um…and then when she began to

moved towards the door, beyond the initial concern for Officer Anderson, was then the big

realization that, that I was stuck.

DEWEY: Uh, so you mentioned prior to going upstairs you guys discussed the incident a little bit or

discussed what, what was going on a little bit. Can you describe a little bit more again what

you guys were discussing prior to going upstairs?

MCNEW: As far as uh, our conversation from the cars to the location, Officer Anderson was filling me

in as to what he had read from the report um, I remember him and, you know, stating that

there was another incident and mentioning that she had brandished scissors. Um, I don’t

recall how long before this incident that that prior one had taken place. Um, and he had

explained or he had at least briefly discussed that officers had arrived. He gave me a synopsis

of the incident and a very brief one that they had arrived to some sort of DV call, uh, so I, I

knew that that was the nature of the call and then, uh, she had brandished scissors and until I

reviewed my video, I didn’t realize that he had also mentioned that she had began, uh, talking

about things that, that may be, uh, were related to mental illness, about you know, morphing

and that kind of thing. Um, but I recall that as we walked up to the door that there was a

moment where I, I clarified with them like you know, wait, you know, what was the

circumstances as far as, I had thought she had called for help from officers and they arrived

and that she brandished scissors in an effort to more or less, uh, that they weren’t helping her

and she wanted then out and then he clarified, no, she was standing between them and the

doorway and didn’t want to let them leave. He said, she was arrested. Now prior to that,

when I had asked him um, about the information, he said it was an officer safety caution and I

asked him, you know because he was telling me this stuff, I asked him if she was flagged at

you know, mentally ill in our system? To which he said no, it’s just and officer safety, which

I thought was a little odd.

DEWEY: Okay. And upon arrival, uh, did you happen to observe any civilians or witnesses in the area

that were observing the incident?






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MCNEW: Honestly, I d-, I don’t remember seeing anyone out and about in the courtyard. Uh, just after

the shooting the, uh, a male occupant at the end had ducked his head out, asking what was

going on and I told him to stay inside. Um, and then after this incident is when I emerged

and, um, a crowd had began to, or people began to emerge and start looking on.

DEWEY: And are you aware of anyone that was taking photographs or video?

MCNEW: The only thing I recall is when we were standing by the, uh, the patrol cars, uh, after we had

come out, after the, I believe the public safety, um, card that my Acting Sergeant had done,

looking up and seeing another building, um, I saw basically someone on a top story of another

building holding out a cell phone which I assumed they were recording the event. Um, but

beyond that, no I’m not aware of anything.

DEWEY: And when you say recording event…

MCNEW: Uh, in my knowledge as a police officer, when someone’s standing around a police scene and

they’re holding their phone out, they’re typically recording, you know the going-on’s. And so

I saw somebody, uh, it looked like a, possibly like a female subject, um, so there was the

building of the incident which was on the property, would be the southeast. Then adjacent to

that, uh, there’s several more buildings to the west, all in that same complex. Then you’ve got

the driveway that we entered on and on the north side of that there’s another building and I

just recall, because of the position of our cars, looking up and seeing someone holding a cell

phone, so I figured they were recording everything.

DEWEY: Uh, so what was your legal authority to be where you were?

MCNEW: The subject had requested our presence to report a burglary and upon arriving, uh, let us in.

DEWEY: And, and what was your legal purpose for the contact?

MCNEW: Um, the legal purpose was she was reporting a crime so we were there to, to take note of the

crime she was reporting.

DEWEY: So from start to finish, uh, more specifically for the, the use of force itself, how long do you

think that the incident lasted?

MCNEW: Well, I was afforded the ability to watch my video so from that I believe I assessed from the

time we made contact with her uh and/or entered the building to the time force was used, I

believe it was 4 to 5 minutes.

DEWEY: Okay. And up to the point where force was used, or the knife was brandished, and you saw

her with a knife, how long do you think between that time?

MCNEW: Between seeing or recognizing the threat and and…






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DEWEY: Yes.

MCNEW: …using force? In my mind, several minutes, in reality probably seconds. I believe I was able

to get a, a help call out and some sort of description, um, during the, the tiniest little break and

it was seconds later that we shot.

DEWEY: So you mentioned, in your mind it felt like several minutes, can you describe, you had some,

an-, any other perceptual stuff going on at the time?

MCNEW: Well initially, um, up until I was afforded the ability to, uh, review my video, is I, I recall her,

I, I knew that she was yelling at us, I knew she was saying something but I can’t remember

the words and I knew that we were saying things, but I couldn’t remember what we were

saying. Um, and then of course there’s the…the time. Initially, you know, this thing pops out

and you know, your eyes recognize it and things are going through your head so fast, you

know, you’re processing these things so fast, much faster than you normally would, so that the

time feels like it draws out, like I feel like she produced the weapon, you know we were trying

to take cover or position ourselves, you know, get radio out. You know I’m thinking about

where she’s at, thinking about escape, I’m thinking about the kids, I’m thinking you know

now she’s throwing knife at me, I go down, okay, I’m okay, I get up, now she’s coming

towards the middle, I mean you’re processing all these things. And if you had been doing that

on a normal day that would take minutes. You know your mind just kinda goes through these

things, but when you’re in one of these situations, your mind’s still keeping up, your minds

racing a mile a minute, but it’s not as long as you think and so, like I said, after watching the

video, I realize even between getting commands out, getting a help call out, then it was over.

DEWEY: So earlier you mentioned that you gave a public safety statement to a supervisor, who did,

which supervisor was that?

MCNEW: Uh, it was my supervisor, Trent Schroeder, Schroeder.

DEWEY: And what actions did he take?

MCNEW: He read the public safety information. Um, I believe the goal at that point was to get the

initial description. SWAT had arrived with a full team, um, and people kept asking me where

he was was, where he was, so I think the, so he asked me, the general questions. I, and qui-,

quite frankly I couldn’t recall them for ya.

DEWEY: Did you use any type of force other than what’s been reported?

MCNEW: No.

DEWEY: Other than your SPOG Guild rep, uh, a CISM representative, your attorney, uh, or, or a FIT

representative, did you discuss this incident with anyone prior to the interview?

MCNEW: My wife.






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DEWEY: Okay. And just a brief, I mean, what, you call her, you called your wife.

HUGHEY: You can’t ask questions that’s protected communications.

COBB: Yeah. I don’t think (unintelligible).

DEWEY: My apologies. Uh, was the subject handcuffed?

MCNEW: No. Not to my knowledge.

DEWEY: And did you notice any injuries to her prior to the use of force?

MCNEW: No.

DEWEY: And were you or any other officer injured, any other officers injured during this incident?

MCNEW: To my knowledge, no.

DEWEY: Okay. So other than, uh, the radio problem, having, getting your radio out of traffic, did you

know of or did you have any equipment related issues or concerns during this incident?

MCNEW: None that I’m aware of.

DEWEY: And was any of your department or equipment damaged during this incident?

MCNEW: Not that I’m aware of.

DEWEY: What is your date of hire?

MCNEW: Oh gosh, uh, 2/5/2008, if I remember right.

DEWEY: And can you please give a brief summary of your training and history?

MCNEW: Uh, I’ve completed the basic law enforcement academy. Uh, 8 weeks of Post BLEA training.

Yearly street skills training. I’ve been a shotgun officer, I believe I was a shotgun officer for

2 to 3 years and all the accompanying training. I’m ACT trained, undercover trained. Um, s-,

um, CIT trained, uh, for the last, I believe 3 to 4 years with the accompanying yearly, um,

additional training. Uh, I’m Sergeant trained, um,…I don’t recall anything else.

DEWEY: Okay. Uh, did you serve in the military at all?

MCNEW: I did not.






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DEWEY: Okay. And what is your current assignment and how long have you worked there?

MCNEW: I am north patrol, and I have worked there since December of two-thousand and eight.

DEWEY: And what’s your call sign?

MCNEW: Uh, currently today, I’m a relief squad, so today was 1 – UNION – 1.

DEWEY: What is your serial number?

MCNEW: 7451.

DEWEY: Do you have a regular partner?

MCNEW: I do not.

DEWEY: Were you in a marked patrol vehicle?

MCNEW: I was.

DEWEY: And were you in uniform?

MCNEW: I was.

DEWEY: So, what less lethal options did you have available on both your person or in your vehicle?

MCNEW: I carry a, baton, mounted on my vest.

DEWEY: So from head to toe then, can you walk me through, uh, what you wear during a normal day of

patrol, or what you were wearing today?

MCNEW: Um, I wear a load-bearing vest. Um, if you gonna go from my left to right, I’ve got a, um, a

radio holder, um, double magazine, or 2 magazine pouches, handcuff pouch, uh, a small

flashlight, and then baton, and then my um COBAN mic is mounted, uh, just below my arm

on my right side. Uh my belt consists of my belt, a drop holster, um, and that’s it.

DEWEY: And how long has it been since you’re slept?

MCNEW: Oh…it’s about 1900 so what’ that, minus 2 o’clock.

HUGHEY: You got up at 2?






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MCNEW: I got up at 2, I don’t know what the math is.

HUGHEY: 2AM.

DEWEY: 2AM?

MCNEW: 2AM, I apologize. 0200 hours, so I’m not sure what the math is on that right now.

DEWEY: Okay. And what time did you start working?

MCNEW: Uh, 3AM.

DEWEY: And can you describe the, the environment, uh, weather conditions, lighting, things like that?

MCNEW: Um, at the time of the incident?

DEWEY: Yes.

MCNEW: Overcast. um, I believe there was either a slight drizzle. Um, I recall standing outside after

the incident and it being overcast with slight drizzle at that point. Um, mid-morning so

typical light in an overcast day in Seattle.

DEWEY: Okay. Do you have any questions?

CORBIN: Just one, uh, clarifying, you did mention, um, we talked about the knife that you saw

originally…

MCNEW: Correct.

CORBIN: …when you had the obstacle between you. And then the subject moved around…and you’d

noticed 2 knives, did you describe the knives themselves.

MCNEW: Um, the initial knife that I saw…and I don’t know if the other knife, uh, followed entail, I

don’t recall, um, it’s been too many hours in the day. But the initial knife, I want to say was a

3 to 4-inch blade fixed knife, um, my initial thought was it was a kitchen knife of some sort.

Um, and do want to not that to my knowledge, um, she had not entered the kitchen, uh, during

our contact um…and thus you know, I never saw her enter the kitchen and pick up a knife, so

I don’t know where she, where she retrieved it from, but it didn’t come from the kitchen as far

as I understand.

CORBIN: And do you have any memory of the second knife description?

MCNEW: Similar size, if I remember correctly, but at that point, I mean things were going about a mile

a minute so I can’t, within any reasonable certainty, describe it to you.






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CORBIN: Okay, thank you. That’s all.

DEWEY: Sergeant…

VERHAAR: I have a couple of questions, and I have to apologize, I kinda, I was thinking about something

and I spaced a little bit. Uh, when you’re describing, uh, what you’re wearing from your head

to toe, um, wer-, are there any patches that identify who you work for and on your uniform

and where would they be?

MCNEW: So on the vest, um, I wear a badge and right beneath that I wear a, um, Velcro strip that’s

approximately an inch, inch and ½ wide and about 6 inches long that say “Police” in bright

white letters. Uh, the shirt that I’m wearing now is what I was wearing at the time of the

incident. I’m wearing, if you note, patches on both shoulders that say “Seattle Police”. Um,

and I believe on the rear of my vest I’ve got a patch, uh, a Velcro sticker that’s approximately

2 inches by maybe 10 inches that says “Police” in bright white block letters.

VERHAAR: Okay. And another thing I’m, uh, again, you know I’m, while you’re talking I’m trying to

process, um, you were asked the question, you know did you revet-, um review your COBAN

video prior to the interview and uh if you did, did it change your perception. I think you said

no, but yet you’ve, you’ve stated several times, um, that the, you gained some language off of

that video. So my question to you again is, did it change your perception or memory or did it

enhance your memory and perception…(unintelligible)…

MCNEW: It enhanced it. I knew that I had said things, I just you know given, given the way the incident

went, uh, the hectic-ness surrounding it and the long day, I just, I couldn’t remember what the

words were.

VERHAAR: I just wanted to clarify that. Thank you.

DEWEY: Okay. Uh, so at this time uh myself, Sergeant Verhaar, your attorney, your SPOG rep and

your OPA rep are gonna step out. Uh, Detective Corbin’s gonna stay in the room with you.

MCNEW: Okay.

DEWEY: Uh, the, the audio will stay on so try not to talk, it, it brings up transcription stuff but uh, he’s

not gonna ask you any questions. If you need to use the restroom, now’s a good time.

MCNEW: Okay.

UNKNOWN: (Unintelligible).

DEWEY: Uh, were just gonna take a step out and brief a little.

HUGHEY: Could you give me a moment; I need to use the head also please.






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DEWEY: Absolutely.

VERHAAR: Sorry to…interrupt you guys like that.

DEWEY: No, that’s okay.

HUGHEY: Do you just want to hang in here with Steve?

ANDERSON: Yeah

HUGHEY: And then we’ll come back in a few minutes.

ANDERSON: Absolutely.

HUGHEY: (Unintelligible).

MCNEW: Yeah, we’re still recording.

ANDERSON: Okay. Good to know.

ANDERSON: They have phone chargers if you need one.

MCNEW: That would be great.

ANDERSON: Do you think you want it?

MCNEW: Yeah, I’m dead.

ANDERSON: I always try to bring phone chargers ‘cause…I’m gonna go grab it.

MCNEW: Yeah, if you’ve got an Android, that would be great.

ANDERSON: Samsung?

MCNEW: Yes, please.

CORBIN: For the recording, that was the voice of Kim Anderson from Peer Support.

DEWEY: Okay, uh, so everyone’s back in the room. Uh, just a couple of quick clarifying questions, uh,

during this incident and, and, and I know when you drew the sketch here you just, the door

showing, is, mainly to show where the door was. Do you recall if he door was open or

closed?






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MCNEW: I don’t. I don’t.

DEWEY: Could you see the door?

MCNEW: Uh, at that point, I, I don’t honestly recall. Um…

DEWEY: And then just to clarify, so there’s 2 officers, it’s a, it’s a burglary report and, and it was a, a

burglary that already had happened, correct?

MCNEW: Correct.

DEWEY: Um, what would the typical response be for a non-in-progress burglary?

MCNEW: Uh, it’s typically a paper report with some in, on-scene investigation, uh, if there’s any, uh

evidence to be collected. Generally, a patrol officer will respond to the scene and contact the

individual, um, and get the pertinent information to the crime as to when it occurred, what

was taken, uh, the different elements, collect any evidence if possible, provide the victim with,

uh, any necessary forms and a business card.

DEWEY: And so, I know you’ve explained it very detailed so far, what differed with this call? What

made this call different?

MCNEW: So, to my knowledge, in this particular call is the person who called in, um, my understanding

was that radio had ascertained that there was either another call at the location or was directly

attached to the subject who called, there was an officer safety hit on it.

DEWEY: Okay.

VERHAAR: So, following up with that, so in your, how many officers would respond to a typical

burglary?

MCNEW: Typically, barring some sort of location requirement, uh, a typical burglary is 1 officer.

VERHAAR: Okay.

DEWEY: Uh, and then just to follow-up on, I know you said you’ve been up since 2 in the morning, uh,

how much sleep did you get last night?

MCNEW: Typical 1st watch night, so about 5 hours.

DEWEY: Okay. So at this time, uh, I don’t have anymore (unintelligible), any more questions for you

uh, (unintelligible), find my back page here. Sorry. Got all my paperwork all messed up here

and I need to find…






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CORBIN: What are you looking for?

DEWEY: The last, the last page.

CORBIN: The last 2 pages.

DEWEY: No the one that explains the…

UNKNOWN: (Unintelligible)…this one?

CORBIN: The one I had.

DEWEY: There we go. Alright so at this time I’m, I don’t have any further questions, uh, Sergeant

Verhaar is gonna, uh, provide you with a, like a reference guide to everything what, what

happened here. Uh, if not already done, I don’t know, have you done a blue team entry yet?

Okay. Okay, so we’re gonna just need to do a, a blue team entry real quick and then we r-, we

do recognize that often times, and in this case you’ve already explained, I mean you’re, you’re

tired, you might not remember everything. Um, so we, we will probably need to, or we will

be scheduling you with a follow-up interview, okay? Um, at the conclusion of the audio re-,

interview here, we’re gonna schedule that, a follow-up interview. Uh, do you have any

questions?

MCNEW: Not at this time.

DEWEY: Okay. Well at that time, this will con- uh, any, any, sorry, anybody else have any questions?

Okay. At that time this will conclude the interview, uh today’s date is still June 18th, 2017 and

the time is now 1913 hours.

seattle statement form o police 2017-219301 ... - spd blotter · dewey: alright, this is detective...

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