MIN O S;

o r, O n Law

T ranslated by T HO MAS L. P AN GLE

Socrates, A Comrade

llJ ~ SOCRATU : What is law, fo r us?!CO MIl:A. IlE: And what so rt of laws arc you asking about?soc .: What? Is there some way in which taw differs Irom law inregard to this VtT)' thing. in regard to its being law? For j ust conside rwha t I now happen to be asking you. I am asking this J USt as if I hadasked. "what is gold?"'-if you thus asked me what sort of gold I wasspeaking of. I think yOll would nOI be asking oil correct qoe aion. For

b presumably gold doesn't differ from gold, or stone from stone, atleast in regard [0 being stone and ill regard to being gold. And thusneither does law. presumably, ditTer at 211 from law but they are allthe same thing. For each o f them is law [0 the same degree-s-nor o nemore so and another less. This is the very thing I am asking: what islaw as :I whole? 50 if you have the answer at hand, speak.COM. : What else wo uld law be, Socrates, except the things th at arelaw fully accepted?2

M Il){K wn the ICl;Uld ~f}' (ollndn O( C ....,IC ~ml l hc bin"r ....emy of Athnl\ . As th e

d i.olog\lc indiu t"", the ~CC'OlJn" ~l rr"",,Ji ng him Are uf n."·" .." n s. Aerording lo ....elu dilion. he w I , tr U nn;"..:! . h~ ,.;h, l nd imP""ti..Ji~ lic; l erord inll. 10 another, he w~. th"grelt""l of llwgive,.;. illspi l<:d dir«i ly b~' Zeus, his f~thcr . Sec 1..>..', 6::,_: .~. ,00;Plutarch Thesr'" xv-x.;; Strabo G«w"r"r X i ,- 8, 19; D 'odoru ..Siculus IV 60 l nd V

".1111;. semence is 3mhiguol1"; il could l lw 1I1"l n. " Whl l is Ihe b .... ~ 'n.... 'g us?" Inthe Greck, lhe fint wo rds in Ihe di ~ logue I re " T he bw"

me word I have tr~nsbled " 'l ", fully ..ec.:plco.l" is .. p..n ieiple form~ (rom Ihe"n b ,,~,"iz~ , ....hk h h... lhe urne roU( U ""...." ("b w"). Like """''''. "","iz~ h..... wid..

"

54 T ranslated b)' Thomas L. Pangle

soc.: And so is speech in your opinion the things that arc spoken, o rsighe the things that are seen, o r hearing [he things that are heard? O r

c docs speech seem something different from the things that are spo­ken, and sight something different from the things that arc seen, andhearinlt something dif f erent fro m [he things [hal are heard, and law,indeed, something different from the things rhat are law fully accept­ed? Is this the way it seems to you. or how else?COM. : Now it docs .lIppcar to me differem .soc .: $0 then law is nOI the things that arc lawfully acrcpred.COM. : It doesn 't seem to me to be,soc.: So what then would law be? let' s investigate it in the followingway. lf someone had asked us, in regard to the things said just now,

J I ,,~ "Since it is by sight that you declare that rhc things that arc sccu areseen. by the sight's being wh ar are they se<:n?"- we would havereplied 10 him that it is by its being this perception that showsmatters) through the eyes. And if, again, he had asked us, " Wha[then? Since it is by hearing [hat the things that arc heard arc heard, bythe hearing's being what docs this take place?" -we would havereplied to him that it is by its being this perception that makes voicesmanifest to us through the cats . In the same way, then, if he shouldask us, " Since it is by law that the things b.wfull y accepted are

b lawfully accepted , by the law 's being w hat arc they lawfully accept­ed? Is it by its being some percep tion, o r some showing , as the things[hat arc learned arc learned by the science that shows them, or somediscovery as the th ings that arc discovered are discovered-cfor in­stance, rhe Ihings peru.ining to health and sickness by [he medical art,and, on the o ther hand, the' things the gods think (as ehe divinersclaim) by the divining 2rt? Since for us art is presumably a discoveryof things; isn 't it?"COM. : Certainly.so c.: So which of these would we especially take law to be?

c CO,\! . : In my opinion at least , these offi cial opinions and decrees

nn ll:e of p<>s. ible me~ni nll:s. ind udinll: "prutk e or u'" nmom~rily. " " be Ieg~l or('\I."",' ..y," ".,n. cr n I t'j,:~l or •• I<'g~1 ('\I' to lll," ~ "d " u !:nowl.,utt." ~ ecc l't. or be-­1;""'1.'''- 0[1<:11 " in the I~wful or ~-ustom..y w~)' , " In or.kr to hi "hl i~h t the; ronnC'(_lions wit h I~w ~nd with ~lic:f or opinion t1ul ~ re p~nmoont in this di~loll:oc, I h;,....,u.u~ll)' t ...ool....<1 """, iz<I n " l~wfu lly ~eeept " ; where 11 w""' nor po..ible to do "". Ih~ve r ba:d an . , tCTis!: .fter the word or word. th. t tnn. h te ""...1.:<1. TI,., re~dc-r

<Jlnuld bur in n"ud Ihu the word m~y ha...e ~ more Kti ...., connota tion th~n theE" lo:lish "acrepr" ml~ht s" lo:ltn t.

'T wo In ...... m~nu .cri ph read: " show. eM"" 10 WI ."

Minos 55

passed by votes; for what else wou ld one declare law to be? So as aresult it 's likdy that what YOU' \'c asked about, this whole, law, is theofficial opinion of the city .soc.: What you' re saying, it is likely is that law is political opinion.COM.: I do !>4Y so.soc.: And perhaps what you say is no bly put . But probably we willknow better by proceeding as follows. You say some are wise?COM. : I do say so.so c.: Aren't the wise wise th rough wisdom?COM. : Yes.SOC. : What then? The just arc j ust th rough j ustice:CO M. : Certainly.so c.: And aren' t the lawful lawful through law?CO M. : Yes.

d SOC . : And thc lawless law less through lawlessnes s>CO M. : Yes.50 (';.: And the lawful are just?CO M.: Yes.SO C. : And the lawless unj ust?CO M.: Unjust.SOC. : Aren't j ustice and I3w most noble?CO M. : That is so.soc.: And injustice and lawlessness most shameful?COM.: Yes.SOC. : And the OIlC saves cities and everything else. while the otherdes troys and overt urns?CO M . : Yes.SOC. : SO then one ought to th ink about law as being something nobleand see k it as good.CO M . : H o w could one nol?soc.: Didn 't we declare law to be the official opinion of the city?

e COM. : We did so declare.soc. : So what then? Arc II Ul some o fficial opinions worthy but otherswicked?CO M. : That is the case.soc.: And now law, at .1I ny rate, W.1lS not wicked.CO M. : No, indeed .soc .: So then it is nOI correct to answer thus, without qualification .that law is the official op inion of the city.COM.: Not in my opinion. at IC3.st.

56 Translated b y Th omas L. Pangle

SOC. : So then it wouldn't fi t harmoniously for the wicked officialop inion to be law.COM. : Certainly not.SOC. : And yet even to me law comes [0 sight OIS being $0 /11 ,. opinion;but since ir is not the wicked opinion, th en ha sn't this now becomem an ifest, that it is the worthy-if law is indeed opinion?COM. : Yes.SOC. : But what is worthy opinion? Is it not true opinion?

) I .s~ COM. : Yr:s ,SOC. : Isn't the true. the discovery of what is?COM. : It is indeed.soc.: Law. then, wishes" to be the discovery of what is.COM. : How is it then, Socrates, iflaw is discovery of what is. tha r wedon' t at all times usc the same laws in the same matters-i f the thingsthat are have indeed been discovered by us?

b soc.: The law wishes, no netheles s, [0 be the discovery of what is, butthe humans who, in our opinion. do not at all times usc the same lawsarc not at all rimes capable of discovering ,v'hat the law wishes-c-wha tis. For come, let' s sec if from this point onward it becomes manifestto us whether we at all times usc the same laws, or di fferent OIll:S atdifferent times. and whether all usc the same or different peoples uscdifferent ones.CO M. : Out this at least, Socrates, is not difficult to know-that thesame people do nor at all rimes usc the sallie laws and that differentpeoples usc different ones. Because, for exampl e, among us il is notthe law [0 sacrifice humans, but it is instead impious. while the

C Ca rthaginians do perform the sacrifice as something that is pious andlegal for them, and some of them even do these thiugs with their ownsons, for the sake: of Kronoss-c-as perhaps you too have heard.e And

' ''W\shn to be" IS a l i te~l rcndcrm g of a phr~<c (bcwltl..i rin.." Ih~1 usually Iu s thecc>lIoqu;~ 1 m e-~nin" of "!mds 10 be " ; this helps e~rb in the- romr~nhm's rn pon.... . lim~s Socute~ m~kcs de-u in his next Ull e-r~IICe- . he me~ns 10 bri llK 10 the surface the11U:r~ 1 n.e....IlI'1l. (Arislode ....lIIet;IIICS Joo the "",mt"-"",e- , e-.K., Pol il io IlSVl:>6 ~nJ

context),sKronos was Ihe- (~lhC'T of 7.C1IS and c~me- to poWC'T by lc-3Jln~ a revolt of hi,

brolhe... and , iSle-.s ("the- Ti uns") ~K~i"sl hIS falhC'T. Ouunos. II vas prophnico:l lhathe ill his turn wo uld he o..enhrcwn by ~ wll of his own, ~nd 10 fornull thc prophecyhe ~Ie his own children, bUI hi, wife, nhe~. hid the b~by Zc~ (ro m hilll. .md Zeu.h...c.-d 10 (ultill lhe- rror~ ('iCC UcsioJ Thrpg""r IJI - J K, lQ?-\ O, " SJ- j O">, 1'Il')­

7H). Diodnrus Sieulus (X X I,,) lells how the C~rl h~ gi ni~ns u ,·rilicc.-d their noblCSI""n. in hOllo , . ~nJ in ;miUlinn. of K"'>ll<" _

"One of the- m~Jor m~nu'(TIpI' tC'~J . . ..~. pcrlupo )'ou h~"'e ,,'" he-aN."

Minos

"it's not j ust barbarian human beings w ho usc laws d iffe ren t fro mours, but these people in Lycaea? and the des cendan ts of Athanu.:,>R­what so n of sacrifices do they per for m, even though they're Greeks!As to ourselves, presu mably you too kno w, fro m having heard your­self, what sort o f laws we use-d to usc in regard 10 rhe dead, slaugh ter­ing the sacred victims before the c arrying o ut of the corpse andsending: for the women who collect the bones in urns; and aga in , the

d people who lived sti ll ea rlier used to bury the dead where they were,in the house. But we do none o f thes e things. Someo ne could tell often thousand such things; fo r there's plcnty of roor nfo r a dernonsrra­tion that neither we ;l;mo ng ourselves no r ma nkind .11 brge at all rimesh wfutl y accept the same th ings.so c.: It 's no wonder, best o f men , if what you S;ly is correct. and thishas escaped my no tice. But so long: 3 S you tell how things seem toyou by speaking in your o wn mann... r, wi th length y speech, and I in

e tum do so, we wilt never get together a ll any thing . I believe. If. o nthe orher hand, the investigatio n is set forth as a commo n O IlC , per­haps we would co me to agree. So if yo u wish. in vestiga te- in com monwith me by asking me so me thing : o r if you wish . do the answering.COM. : But 1'11I willing . Socrates, to answer whatever you wish.soc.: C ome then, which do you believe-s-that the j ust things arcunj ust and the unjust things j ust, o r that the j ust things are j ust w hilethe unj ust things arc unjust?CO M. : For me it is tha t the just things arc just and the unjust th ingsUIlJus t.

J I 6~ so c . : And isn't it believed in this way by everyone. ;1<; it is here?CO M.: Y tOS .

SOC. : An d isn't it s o a lllo ll g the I)ersians?[Lacuna1'1

7lyUc.l wu ~ 10 ,",11 i ll "re~d i~, n"'J r a monmnn !lUI W~, 011... o( lhe pl~eC"S .up­po>cd 10 be Zeu' 5 birlhpu ce. It W.lS {he " Ie 01 ~n imp<.>"~"( .~ tl'l~ry and cuI,founJ ed by l)"e~on. In fOU llJ IIl ~ Ihe cull. l yeJon ucnficcJ J Po}' 10 u u,. Th"

offNing JngcrcoJ Zeu., bIll J o pilc Ih.. pUlli. hmcnl> Ill' .efl!. the illhJhiUnt' cont;uucoJthe pu ctiC!;". ~nd il WJ, .... iJ IN t every Ill " '" yC'~n J boy w n u ("n ti, ed ~Ild hi' Oc.hC'Jlrn (cf. RefllM;e S6 Sd; I·~u,~n i.. . VIII ii I- Z ~"d VI ,';,i Z; Apollodoru. 1tI vii I).

"HerodoIU' \VII (97) lell, ofhum~" ~rnfice< offercoJ bv Greek> who hved in theJr..~ of 11M: IOWn of AI,,, in Ach~eJ . in , onn....1iou wilh J cult uf the h...ro .... th~mJ';

AlhJmu WJ' ' '' pp<........J to h~vc founded Alu , ~l1<1 , Ihroui:.h J cnmpliU lc,1 in"'g" ...,w~. deceived into ,ltIcmpnn!l: J human >.JCJilice. O ne ofSophod e<'lo'l u~!tC'die< wu300m him (cr. PJU UnlJ, I "Ii,' " ~nd IX U,,\V ..- s;ApoUodoru. 1 vii J aed II I iv J ).

'Tfh... nu nuscripn u ck ~ny reply from Ihe corn ' JJ ...: ' '''''e h. ;.-f reply h~, rrob~"'y

been lo, t. though on... CJnnot rule oul Ih... f'O'. ihilily IhJI the cO"'l'"n io l1 . implylemJinc.! ..Icnt .

5S 'I'eanslared by Thomas L. Pangle

SUC. : But at 311 times. surely?COM. : At all times.soc . : Is it believed here tha t the things that wei gh more are heavier,and the things that weigh less lightl:r. or the o pposite?COM. : No--bu t that!" the things that weigh more arc heavier and thethings that weigh less lighter.soc.: And isn't it so in Carthage and in Lycaca?COM. : Y es.

b soc.: The noble things. as is likely, are everywhere lawfully acceptedas no ble and the shameful things as shameful but not the shamefulthings as nob le o r the noble things as shameful.COM.: T hat is so.soc .: And it is the case. to speak universally, that the things that areare lawfully accepted :I S being, not the things that are not-e-both byus and by all the others.CO M. : That is my opinion, at least.soc.: So then he who errs about wh at is. errs abo ut the legal.COM. : Thus, Socrates , as you say, the same things come to sight as

C legal, both for us at all tim es and for the others. But when l reflectthat we never sto p changing the laws, this way and tha t, I can't bepersuad ed.soc.: Perhaps because you do not reflect tha t these things, beingmoved as d raug hts pieces. remain the same. Burjoin me in o bserv ingthe things in the following w:ly: now, have you ever encountered awriting about the healing of the sick?t";OM. : l indee d have.soc.: You know , then, to wh at art thi s w riting belongs?COM.: I do know: medicine.soc .: Don't you call "doctor s" the men who have knowledge aboutthese things?COM.: SO I declare.

d SOC.: Is it the case that the same things arc accepted" , about the samematt ers, by those who have knowledge. o r different th ings by differ­ent ones?( .:0 .'\1. : The same ebings, it seems to me at least.soc.: Is it the case that the same things arc accepted" only by theGreeks amo ng Greeks or also by the barbarians among rhernselvesand among the- Greeks .as well-in regard to matters they may know?

'''<.In... o f th... tw a bc!. t m <>.nu MTil"U Iu~ " N t_ but it ;~ bdi...vnl- h........ th~1 ("'IC.). "

Minos 59

CO M. : Surely there is a great necessn v that those who know- Greeksand b arb aria ns :as wdl- :agrec< with themselves in :lCCeptinS· thesame things.soc.: You're answering nobl y. And isn 't this the case at :all times?CO M. : Yes, at all times.

e soc .: And do n' t doctors w rite, about healing, things that they ac­cepr'" as being so?CO M. : Yes.SOC . : T hat medical, and medical laws, is what these writings of thedoctors arc.COM. : Medical they indeed are.soc.: So then, too, agricultural w ritings arc agricultural bws: "COM. : Yes.SOC . : Whose, then, are the w ritings and legal customs concern ing theworking of gardens?CO M. : Gardeners' .SOC . : So then for us thes e are ga rdening laws.COM. : Y es.

SOC. : Belonging to those who have knowledge of how to rulegUdt'11S?COM. : Who else?soc.: And it is the gardeners who have knowledge.CO M. : Y es.

SOC. : And whose arc the w ritings and legal customs concerning rhepreparanou of cuisine?COM. : Cooks' .soc.: So <hen these arc cooking b ws?COM. : Cooking.

J 1 7~ soc.: lklonging, as is likely , to those who have knowledge of how torule the preparauon of cuisine?COM, : Y es.

SOC. : And the cooks, as they cl;lim, have the knowledge?COM. : For they do have the knowledge.soc.: Well. and whose, indeed. arc the writings and legal customsconcerning the organizing of <1 city? Don't they then belong to thosewho have know ledge of how [ 0 ru le a city?CO M. : In my opinion, at least.

liT wo in..: ! llu mlKlip lS In vc " !tc" rn'1nu l" Vl<'","ttrik.r) i'~~l c..d of " ~gticu llu t~l "

(~~"':I:jk,,).

(,0 T ranslated by Thomas L. 1'000g)0:-

SOC. : Arc they who have the knowledge any others except the states­men and the kings?COM.: These arc indeed the ones .so c.: So th~"t1 these things which human beings call taws are politicalw ritings-the writings of kings and good 1Il(,1l.

b COM. : What you say is true.soc.: Well those, certainly. who have knowledge wiJlnot write dif_fcrem things ar dilTercnt times about the same things?CO M.: No.SOC. : Nor will they ev er, concerning the same m atters, change o neset of legal customs for ano ther.COM. : No indeed.so c.: So if we sec certa in persons doing this anywh ere. will wedeclare the ones doin g this to be those who have knowledge or thosewho lack knowledge?CO M. : Those who lack knowledge.soc .: And won't we declare that wh ich is correct to be the legalcus tom for each-c-cnher medical o r cooking or g.udening?

c co .....: Yes..soc. : BUI that wh ich is not correct , th is we will no longer declare tobe the legal custom ?COM.: No longer.soc.: So then it becomes lawles s.CO M. : Necessaril y.SOC. : And then in the writings about the just and unjust things. and ingeneral about ordering a city and about how a dty ough t to beorganized. what is correct is kingly law. while what is not co rrect-s­what seems to be law to those who don't know-is nOI. For it islawless.co..... : Ycs.

d soc .: So rhen we were correct ill agreeing that law is the discovery ofwhat is.CU.\\.: SO it appears.soc.: But further . let's look into the following aspect of it : who hasknowledge of d iseribm ing ta seeds on the earth?

' TTb.: word for "d"lnb"lill!t" (did" " .....') h~, Ihe "'Ille root "'0 the word for lAW'".."",.). Th~ onK""'] n.e~ni n~ of [hi~ root ",,~m, 10 Iuve 1;>c.'I;D [h~ iok~ of ~pro'"tilllt

pasture to herds. and the Greek word for " b w" s«m. ec hn e nuined an « ho of Ihi,uri lo:in . l nolinn " ffli . nr rel.......hlc di.trihul;nll. The 0" 0'.1 for "diol, ibulmg" ~I>o

m~~n, "P"' IUrill!t." ~nd [he wo rd fo r "hf .d' ll...n" 0. " pn lW"f"" io lhe ... Ille ., the....c-d for "dembueor" ('ICC" Emm.lt1ucl Laroche. ",Sllli., J, I.t .....i'" ....'E,\I rrl G,rtd ..ri .... [pni•• 1I)~\I]) .

Minos 61

COM. : The farmer.SO C. : And th is m an dist ributes rhe suitable seeds to each p;lrt of theearth?CO M.: Yes.SOC. : The farmer, the refore, is a good distributor of these things, andthe laws and distributions of this mall. to these thin gs, are correct?COM. : Yes.SOC. : And who is a good distributor of notes 10 songs, and distri butesthe suitable ones, and whose are rhe correct bws?

" co...... : T hose of the aulist and the citharisr.soc.: The most knowledgeable about law, then, in these m atters , isthe one w ho is most knowledgeable about the aulos.COM. : Yes.SO C. : And who is best at distributing food to the bodies of humans?Isn't it he who distributes what is suitable?CO M. : Yes.SOC. : SO then the dist ributions of this man. and the L1WS, are the best,and whoever is most knowledgeable about the law concernin g thesethings is also the best distributor.t:O M . : Ce rtainly.soc. : Who is this?

.l lh t:O M .: Th e trainer.SOl;.: T his man is the most capable of pasturing the human herd of thebod y?l:\CUM. : Yes.SOC. : And w ho is the most capable of pasturing 3 herd ofsheep? Whalis his name?CO J,I. : Shepherd.so c.: So then the laws of the shepherd are the best for the shee p.CO M. : Yes.SOC. : And those of the cowherd (or the cattle.CO M. : Yes.SOC. : And whose laws arc best for the souls o fhur nans ? Aren' t theythose of the king? Declue it!CO M. : I do declare it.

b soc.: N ow you' re speaking in a noble fashion. Would you then be

UW. R. M. umbof~ fu n, LuoT of the Loeb "dll ion. po' nl' tc tbis lm,, ~, rcrh~p.

lhe nron~....e slyhmc evidcn«' Ihal I'lu o could nof h~ ...e wn uen fhe ,\1",o1. E. B.F.ngl~nd. on the confn ry. u...... thi< line ~. a b~.is f<.r introducing an emendation inn.the l..lWI: sc" hi, aurhoritarive philolQginl commentary, T'llt l.... ...J 4 Plato (M~n.

ches ter, 1911) at 803dJ.

62 'l'rauslared by T homas L. Pangle

able to say who among the ancients became a good lawgiver asregards the laws of ehe arr of aulos playin~? Perhaps you don't have itin mind, and want me to remind you?COM. : By all means.soc.: Well, then, is M.usyas spoken of, and his boyfriend Olympos,the Phrygi;tn?UCO M. : What you say is true.soc.: T heir aulos tunes are indeed most divine, and alone move andreveal those who are in need of the gods. And now they alone still

c remain, because they are divine.CO:\I. : These things arc so.soc.: And who of the ancient kings is said to have become a goodlawgi ver, whose legal customs even 1I0 W rem ain , AS being divine?COM. : I don't have it in mind.so c.: Don't you know who among the Greeks use the most ancientlaws?CO M. : S O then you're speaking of the Lacedaemonians and the law­giver l ycurgus?so c.: Bur these. at any rate, arc not perhaps three hundred years old,

d or a Iitde more. But where do the best of these legal custo ms comefro m ? Do you know?CO M. : They claim , at any rate, from C rete.soc.: Th en don' t thes e latter people use the most ancient laws amongthe Greeks?CO M. : Yes.SOC. : Do you know. then, who were the good kings of these pco­plc?-Minos and Rhadamanrhus, the sons of Zeus and Europa-rsthese arc their laws.co!>t.: Th ey claim that Rhadamanthus, at least, W 1 S a just man, So­cu tes. hut that Minos was someo ne savage, hush, and unjust.soc. : BC'S t of men, you're telling an Attic myth , from tragedy!

e co w.: What? Aren't these things said About Minos?

"~h"y.... wn ~ l"I l )"T w ho YiU o" pposcd to Iu ve invcmcd the fint m"oie for m(~"l", . He challenged Apollo to ~ musial dud, d~lnllng hIS new m\l.k ,,·u OUl'fnnrIn .....pollo·. ; he I"", .nd wn lb)'n1 ",Ih'c fo r hi. irnpudc-nu . O lymp<K, hi. lover,;1l\"Cm N ~ num ber of .ungs ~ nJ melod ic!. . HOlh U( 1l1( ntiofl(t.) prom incml y ;n th(LI..-s (6nJ; d . Sym p"' i..... l l 5b, ( , e: Rrp..blu )99<'; E",ltrJ""". l~ 5d; I.... 5Hb).Phrn :i.l W~ • CO\lntr y in A.i~ Minor. and the Phry!':i.>no wcee noe Gr('(b .

u Europ. wu rh( d.ughr(, of Ph"'....ix; Zcu. fcll In 1" ,,( wit h h(, ~nd c~rn",l her ofTIn C rete, w hen . h( boee him the th ree IOn' . M;n... , RIud~m.nlhuo. ~nd S.,pnlon .S« /Ji.lJ XIV ) 2.1.

Minos 63

SOC. : Not. ar any rate. by Homer and Hesiod, and yet they, indeed.arc more trustwo rthy than all the tragic poets taken eogceher, fromwhom you have heard the th ings you ' re saying.CO M. : Bur what. then, do these say about Minos?soc .: I shal1 certainly tell you, so that you will not also be impious, asthe many arc. For there is nothing more impious than this, nothingmore to be guarded against. than to err in speech and deed regardingthe gods and. second , regarding divine human beings. Nay, it 's nee-

ll9-' essary to exert veri great foresight every rime you go to blame orpraise a man , so that you WOIl't spea k incorrectly. T his is why it'snecessary to learn how to distinguish worthy from wicked men. Forthe god is indignanrre when someone blames a man who resembleshim or praises a man who is the opposite ofhim: and the former is thegood man. For you shouldn 't suppose that, while stones arc sacred.and pieces of wood. and birds. and snakes, human beings are not.Rat her, of all thes e things. 17 the most sacred is rhc good humanbeing. while the most polluted is the wicked.

Now then, as regards Minos, this is why I'm going to explain howb Homer and Hcsiod eulogized him: in order to prevent you. a human

being sprung from a human being. from erring in speech regarding J.

hero who W3S a son of Zeus. For Homer. in saying about Crete thatmany hu man beings arc in it. "and ninety cities." declares:

And among them is the great city of Knossos, where MinosIn the ninth season reigned 3S king , the confidant of gre:lt Zeus. III

c Now this is J Homeric eulogy regarding Minos, spoken with bre­vity, the likes of which Homer has not co m posed for a single om' ofthe heroes. For that Zeus is a sophist and that the art itself is ent irelynoble he makes clear in many other places and especially here. For hesays that in the ninth year Minos got together with Zeus to talk. andvisited him to get educa ted-c-as though Zeus were a sophist. Now,rhar this prize. of being educated by Z eu s. is not dis rribured by

"'The wo rd for indi~~I;oll , .......'1i., h... Ih.. ....m.. roor ;as .......<If ( ...... n. I.. alxwe)."One of the IWt> k->I n.."u.crip" hu "of ~llihin its ••"'OJrucy X IX 172.-79. T he .pc~ke r i . the h.-TOOdy. :<c'U>, whl> i. Id ling " Ionll. ~nd

oofwincing Ii.- 10 his wife in whieh he cl"im. 10 be the grandson of Minos . SOCUlnom il' sever..l linn bclWttn lhe bc-ll.lIlmnR and the cndillt: oflhc s.cc1K>n he quoin ~nd

fail. 10 eompl<'le Ilnmcr ', ....nrence. The "an.LlIiun " in the ninlh >c~""n" raIder. ..phu>c whose meaning i• •OInewhal obscu re.

".. TUIl~ b.[ed by Thomas L. P,mglc

d Homer to ,;my other hero except Min os-c-rhis is amazing praise. Andin the raising of the dead spirits in the Odyssey,I" he h15 por trayedMinos, nOI Rhadaman thus, holding the golden scepter and judging;he hasn' t portrayed Rhadamanthus judgi ng these, and he has no­where portrayed him gening together with Zeus. It's because of thesethings thai I assert that Minos W ;l.S eulogized 1II0re than anothers byHomer. For to he the child of Zeus, the only one to have beeneducated by Zeus, is praise that ranuot be surpassed, and [his is whatis signified by the verse

III the nint h sc..son reigned as king, the confidant of great Zeus

~ -1!l;1I Minos was a disciple of Zeus. For "confiding" is talking, and a" confidant" is a disciple in talking, so Minos visited the cave ofZeusat intervals of nine years, on the one hand to learn th ings, and e n theother hand. to show things-the things he h..d learned from Zeus inthe previous nine-year period. Th ere arc some who rake "confidant"10 mean dri nking companion and pb)·fcllow of Zeus, but one mayuse the following evidence 10 show that those who take it thus arc

J201 saying nothing: ofrhe many human beings both Gree k and barbarian,none refrain from drinking parties and fro m this pldy that lakes placewhere there is wine except the Cretans, and second the Lacedaemo­nians who learned from the Cretans. And in Crete this is one amongthe laws which Minos established- not to drink together with oneanother 10 the point ofdrunkenness. Yet it is manifest that the th ingshe lawfully accepted as being nob le we re the things he established as

b legal customs fer his citizens as well. For surdy Minos did not, like apaltry human, believe" some thin gs bUI create others contrary to thethings he believed". Rather, this intercourse was, as I say, one thattook place th rough talking, with a view 10 education in virtue,whence he estab lished for his citizens these laws. by means of whichC rete-c-as well as Lacedaemon-c-is happy for all time, ever since itbegan to use them, for they arc divine.

c Rhadamanthus was indeed also a good man, for he had been edu-cated by Minos. To be sua ' , he had been educated nor in the whole ofthe kingly aft bUI in the att of ministering to a king-enough (Q

preside hi the judicia l courts. h W :IS for this reason that he was said 10

'~OJr<Jrr Xl S6S-7l . Odys'\Cus i. the 'f'<'~J. ~r. dC"cribi"g wh~1 h~ .~w it! hi, trir 10I"~ und~rworld .

Minos Cl5

be a good judge. For Minos used him as a guardian of the- laws for thetown and T2lus21l for the res t ofCrere. For Talus made a circuit threerimes a )'eJr through the villa ges and gua rded rhe laws in them byhaving the laws written down on bronze rablcrs-c-as J result of wbichhe was called "brazen."

d Hesiod too has said things akin to these about Minos. For whcnmentioning his name he declares :

Who carne 10 be the most royal of mo rtal kings.and held sway over the most neighboring humans,possessing the scepter of Zeus; and by it he reigned over cities..:!l

And when he spea ks of the scepter of Zeus, he means nothing otherthan rhe education which came from Zeus, by which he governedCrete.CO M.: O n account ofwhat. then, 50(r.,tes. has this report ever gou t'!1

e spread about concerning Minos. that he was an uneducated and harshfellow?soc.: O n account ofsomething that will nu ke both you. best of men,if you are sensibly moderate. and every other m 3 11 who C2rt'S furgood repute. guard against ever incurring the hatred of any poeticalman . For the poets wield great power over opinion. whichever sortthey create among human beings, either by eulogizing or by pro­nouncing evil.za This. indeed. was where Minos erred: ill warring:lg:linM this city here. in which there exists much other wisdo m andall sorts of poets. of tragedy especially, along with the rest of pm·try.

p u Now trJ gl-dy is an ancient thing here; it did nor, as the)' suppose.originate with Tbcspis or with l' hrvnichos. but if you're willing 1<J

ref lect, you will discover that it's a very ancient discovery of this cityhere.as And the poetry that is the most pleasing to the populace andthe most soul-alluring is rragcdy-c-which. indeed, is thc kind of verse

;o'Accord'ng " , . h.· <>t h" r ,ny.hie ' udllio"••h. t h,,·c come .iow" .o U_. T.I,,_ w .. .

bronu m'n given to MinO'i by ZCU~ " . hdp g""d Crere from e"cnlin. Scc- .... pol.lomus of Rhodes IV r")'JIT. . nd .... pollodo ru. I ix : ".

" These ven~ Uo;' nowhe« to be found in ou. lexU ..f l lnioJ: the met..... of the [,,,t

li"c ili imperfect.UOnc of the tw o mt m. nu...-riptli hu ", u:lJliing" in>te. d of "prenouncmg evil.":!.' Thn pi. w'" the tr.d ition.1 founder of .... ttic tr.gedy. ~upro..,dl y the fi~, pUM

who mrroduced an acm r in di.:tl0!tue ",i.h .he rccilln!t eho rn•. Phrynicho . w•••nmhe.cHly c",,,ribuh" I" the elneTgencc ..fthe " "0': he h"ed in the l"e ,i"lh . nd early fif.h.:cm urics, . nd nnly the lifles of some of hi. pl. y_ . urvive.

(,6 Transbred by Thomas L. Pangle

we stretch Minos on the rack of. in retribution for his having com­pelled us to p~y those rribcres.a- So this was where Minos erred­incurring our hatred, from whence. indeed. CO IllO what you asked

b about. his having gotten a worse reputation. For the greatest evidenceof his having been good and lawful-e-as we said earlier. a good pas­rurer-e-is this: his laws are unchanged. since they belong to one whodiscovered well the truth of what is, in regard to organizing a city.CO M. : You seem to me, Socrates. to have foundas a likely account.soc .: Th en if I'm sayin~ what's true. don't the C retan citizens ofMinos and Rh adamanthus seem to you to use the most ancient laws?CO M. : They do appear to .

c soc.: So then these were the best lawgivers among the ancients, andpasrurcrs and shepherds of men- j ust as Homcr decla red the goodgeneral to be "shepherd of peoples."]I,CO M. : By all means.soc.: Come then, in the name of Zeu s, the god of friendship! Ifsomeone should ask us: " In the case of the good lawgiver and pas­eurcr for the body, what arc these thin gs he distributes to the body inmaking it beuer?"- we would uy. replying in a noble and brieffas hion. that they arc food and toils. by the form er ofwhich he nu kesthe body itsel f grow and b y the latter o f which he exercises and nu kesit fi rm.(;O M. : Correcdy put, indeed.

d soc .: If, then, after this he shou ld ask us: " And whatever, indeed, arcthose things which the good lawgiver and pasturer distributes to thesoul in nuking it bett<:r?"-by answe ring what, would we not beashamed of ourselves and of our years ?COM. : This I can no longer say.soc .: But surely it is shameful for the soul of either of us to bemanifestly ignorant of those things in it in w hich good and baseinhere, wh ile having investigated the things rhat pertain to the bod yand the rest!

UMlno. (ompdlcd the "'t h C11 i~ns to send -even ",.iua n . nd .even youth. 10 C rttcevcry )·ur. to be: C<l!<11 by the Minou ur.

ZOIln Gr.,.,k. the word for " found" o n ;t]w mC<ln "invent." I have here .doptcd lheruJin~ '!l~ro upon by oi" """",,,d...y m. nu!>Oipl. ; the 1.....0 bo,'''1 m1nW;rnp'-' read"ueered" (ri.; " ....."1 rather than " (ound" (11...."'''(1141).

J6/l, frequent cpitho:t for kings ~"d prince'S in Homer.