- 1 Jul –Sep 2018
A Quarterly Publication of Extension & Technical Services Division Jul –Sep 2018
Volume 15-2018 Issue No. 50
It’s the time of the year once again when the prestigious Gawad Saka Awards is honoring the best achievements in the field of agriculture. Definitely one highly-anticipated event, this grand search is being looked forward to annually, with sugarcane as one of the most hotly-contested categories. In review, past winners were simply the so-called “cream-of-the-crop” who were still able to register impressive production in spite of the odds. They may have faced challenges and stumbling blocks along the way but they overcame such through sheer determination, hard work, focus and positive disposition. This truly makes them worthy of the
recognition.
This year, there are only two nominees who are vying for the prestigious title of “Outstanding Sugarcane Farmer.” The one hails from Cagayan and the other is from Batangas. Each is eligible for the title but as in any competition, only one winner can be declared. As the deliberation heats up, let’s get to know the
distinguished nominees:
A True Farmer By Heart
RAMON S. BUNUAN (San Jose, Tuao, Cagayan)
Ramon was born in Taribubu, Tuao, Cagayan and fourth of nine siblings. Born to farmer parents, he practically grew up in the farm. At a young age, he already envisioned that in the
farm, there is income.
He took up Bachelor of Science in Agriculture (Major in Agronomy and Minor in Animal Husbandry) at the Northern Luzon State College of Agriculture in Piat, Cagayan and graduated in 1982. After his marriage to Edna Tamayao, Ramon applied for a casual post at the Department of Agriculture Regional Crop Protection Center in Ilagan, Isabela but resigned after two months since he wanted to
be with his wife.
At first, his father gave him 1.2 hectares of their agricultural land to farm in which he applied his knowledge in the field. Fortunately, he was able to make his farm productive where he grew assorted vegetables, monggo and rice plants. That was just the beginning since in 1985, Ramon was a recipient of the DAR land distribution program in which he was given 3 hectares. He planted it with hybrid corn, monggo and assorted vegies. Again, it became
productive.
Ramon’s maiden venture into sugarcane farming was in 2006, taking advantage of the 3 hectare-land he received from DAR. He begun with 2 hectares. He sought the advice of experienced sugarcane farmers and technological experts in their area. He officially joined the NORFARCO as member to enjoy its benefits. He visited successful farms, notably those of previous Gawad Saka Outstanding Sugarcane Farmers winners. He also attended seminars conducted by the Sugar Regulatory Administration, Cagayan Robina Sugar Milling Corporation (CARSUMCO), planters’ associations, Department of Agriculture and private
companies.
In 2010, he was able to buy four hectares of additional areas for his sugarcane farming. He bought three hectares in San Juan, Tuao and another one hectare in Kinama, Kalinga. In 2016, he again bought 1.5 hectares and planted it with sugarcane. As of 2017, he has a total of 8.5 hectares of sugarcane farms. Because of his experienced success, he further expanded his area to five hectares with a total of 13.5 hectares as of now. From his profit he was able to buy a four-wheeled heavy tractor, two harvesters, three hand tractors, one passenger jeepney and a Ford Ranger
pick-up.
Ramon is not only a model farmer but a dedicated public servant as well. From 2010-2014, he served as Barangay Captain in their area. Considering all the blessings that he has, the nominee is a generous fellow as he lends financial assistance to farm laborers and attends to their needs without interest. He is also compassionate to those living below poverty line and extends
them monetary aid.
The Risk Taker
ARNEL PANGANIBAN (Bgy, Santol, Balayan, Batangas)
Born on January 25, 1973,
Engr. Arnel Panganiban is the
second child of Mr. Gabriel
Panganiban and Ms. Concordia
Apasan Panganiban. They are
both public elementary school
teachers at the Santiago de
Guzman Elementary School in
Brgy. Malibu, Tuy, Batangas,
where Arnel took his primary
education. At a young age, he was already engaged in sugarcane
farming through his grandfather (in his mother’s side) who owns a
(Continued on p. 5)
2018 GAWAD SAKA OUTSTANDING SUGARCANE FARMER NOMINEES
- 2 Jul –Sep 2018
FINANCIAL LITERACY TRAINING: GIVING
THE SOCIALIZED CREDIT PROGRAM A
MUCH STRONGER BOOST
One of the main goals of the Sugar Regulatory
Administration is to help its stakeholders by
improving the plight of the sugarcane farmers when it
comes to the aspect of livelihood. This has always
been one of the agency’s driving forces ever since
Engineer Hermenegildo Serafica stepped in as the new
administrator. One way which this can be achieved is
through the Sugarcane Industry Development Act or
SIDA which was enacted in 2015.
Through said program, farmers will be provided with
the necessary allocation for the continuous production
of sugarcane through the Socialized Credit Program.
In line with its implementation, SRA tapped the Land
Bank of the Philippines (LBP) and the Agricultural
Training Institute to render a seminar to all Mill
District Officers on how to avail both the Socialized
Credit and Financial Literacy Training on February
27, 2018 at the SRA Social Hall.
Representatives from both LBP and ATI were invited
as resource speakers. It was learned in said seminar
that there are 16 different regional/satellite training
centers all over the country that provide these trainings
for free. SIDA’s background and program features
were highlighted in the activity such as: loanable
amount, interest rates, management fees, and other
charges. Also cited were: collaterals, guarantee,
surety, insurance and the additional terms and
conditions for the proper release of the budget. The
minimum acceptance criteria and the documentary
requirements from both SRA and LBP were discussed
as well.
During the open forum, it was discovered that ATI can
provide a trainers’ training for selected SRA personnel
and certify them as resource speakers. This paved the
way for the Extension Services Division of Luzon,
Visayas and Mindanao to hold a joint training on
Financial Literacy at the Luzon Agricultural Research
and Extension Center on June 5-7, 2018.
Aptly titled, “How Money Works!” the training had a
team from ATI Region III as resource speakers. The
course aimed to equip the participants on the basics of
Financial Literacy on agri-enterprises and formulate
an action plan to implement the SRA-LBP Socialized
Credit Program.
After attending the seminar, the MDO’s and their
Junior Agriculturists who are now equipped on the
basics of Financial Literacy are expected to re-echo
the action plans to their respective mill districts. The
training on said topic is an important requirement for
the implementation of the Socialized Credit Program
under SIDA. As SRA’s frontline service providers, the
seminar would equip and turn the participants into
certified trainers. They are expected to cascade the
knowledge they would learn to the grassroots level
having direct contact with the clientele. Through this,
the Socialized Credit Program will get a much
stronger boost.
Included topics in the training module which the
MDO’s and Junior Agriculturists can use in their
actual seminars are: “Filipino Values: Its Importance
to Successful Agri-Enterprises”, “Overview and
Significance of Financial Literacy”, “Business Cycle
and Characteristics of a Successful Agri-Enterprise”,
“Calculating Land Holdings”, “Cash and Credit
Management”, “Creating a Simple Budget”, “Getting
and Managing a Loan”, “Importance of Records”,
“Using Records to Make Decisions” and “Personal
Entrepreneurial Competencies.”
In the following months, some of the mill districts
have already conducted their own Financial Literacy
trainings
Tarlac mill district
participants.
Bukidnon mill district participants.
- 3 Jul –Sep 2018
The Sugar Regulatory Administration (SRA) through its
Extension Services Division and in collaboration with the
Department of Agrarian Reform (Tarlac) recently held a three
-day OPSI training for block farm members in the Tarlac Mill
District on September 26-28, 2018 at the Luzon Agricultural
Research and Extension Center in Floridablanca,
Pampanga.
LAREC OIC Mr. Laverne Olalia officially welcomed the
participants after which, Tarlac Mill District Officer Mr. Joel
Ronario recognized and presented the participants and
guests. On their part, Ms. Precy Landingin, PARPO I, DAR-
Tarlac expressed excitement and enthusiasm on the seminar
which aims to broaden their knowledge on sugarcane
growing and its related topics.
Day One officially started with Mr. Ronario’s reporting of the
Tarlac Mill District’s performance in which he highlighted the:
productivity across farm sizes, variety picture, productivity
constraints in the area, action programs and the number of
SRA-initiated Block Farms.
Next to take the floor was Ms. Rosemarie Gumera, OIC,
Office of the Deputy Administrator, RDE who talked about
the SRA and its SIDA projects. She explained SRA’s two
major functions namely, Regulatory and RDE. Under the
former, the agency is tasked to maintain a balance of supply
and domestic sugar requirement and formulate policies on
the production and allocation of sugar. As for the latter, she
emphasized the important role of OPSI which is being
undertaken by the Extension Service in obtaining higher
yield.
On SIDA projects, there’s Block Farming, rapid propagation
of HYV’s, the infrastructure programs, scholarship program
(in which it was learned that SRA has funded 54 scholars),
socialized credit program (in which it was pointed out that
there should be no duplication in the aid granted) and
industry challenges.
The next speaker was Mr. Arnold de Castro of the
Regulation Department who discussed the following topics:
1) Systems in Regulating Sugar; 2) Sugar Policy; 3)
Classifications of Raw Sugar; 4) Monitor Sugar Production
and Withdrawals; and 5) Conduct of Physical Inventory of
Warehouses.
Following him was Ms. Evelyn Estanislao, Block Farm
Coordinator (L & M) who handled the topic on the SIDA-
Block Farming Project. Ms. Estansialo entertained some
queries after her thorough discussion. One common
question that arose was on how to be a member of the Block
Farm. It was pointed out that the potential group be
endorsed first by the MDDC. Another issue raised was if the
group can avail of SRA’s farm mechanization since DAR has
no budget already. They can, but still, they have to undergo
the accreditation process.
It was evident in the class picture that participants are happy with the turnout of the 3-day OPSI training.
Continued on p. 4
- 4 Jul –Sep 2018
The following day started with a field tour of the participants
as assisted by Mr. Nestor Guiyab. They were toured around
LAREC, made to see some planted varieties plus the tractors
and implements being used. It was really one educational
and informative experience for everybody.
Next came Sr. Science Research Specialist Ms. Vina
Serrano’s lecture on “Sugarcane Breeding/Varieties Suitable
to the District.” She highlighted the commercial hybrid
breeding program, variety improvement, production
technology, crop management, methods of propagation and
the micro-propagation process. As for the varieties suitable
for the Tarlac Mill District, recommended were: Phil 2025-
0055, VMC 87-599 and VMC 84-524 (PS3).
Sr. Agriculturist Mr. Adel Catuira followed suit with his topic
on “Understanding the Sugarcane Plant.” The participants
were all-ears to the discussion in which they learned that the
top 1/3 of the stalk contains many buds and with good
nutrient supply, is very good for use for seed. The lower 2/3
of the stalk meanwhile is high in sucrose. It was also
stressed that the eye of the sugarcane on both sides should
be considered for better germination. One participant also
inquired if the milling is free to which, the answer is no since
there’s a 67-33 planter-miller share.
The next lecturer was Mr. Joel Ronario who spoke about the
“Requirements in Establishing a Nursery Farm.” The
attendees learned the definition of the agricultural jargon
PSTC which means Picul Sugar Ton Cane and that 1 Picul is
equivalent to 1 Ton or 63.25 kilos. One issue that floated as
well during the discussion was on the density of the nursery
which is 40,000 cane points per hectare. A participant also
asked about the advantage of applying chicken manure
which is a good source of nitrogen.
For the day’s last topic, Mr. Catuira took the floor again
afterwards to discuss “Sugarcane Technology for Climate
Change Adaptation in which participants learned the
definition and negative effects of Global Warming on
sugarcane growing.
Science Research Specialist Ms. Agnes Casupanan was the
opening salvo on the third and last training day. She
discussed the topic on “Pests and Diseases” which was so
entertaining and informative. Mr. Benjamin Manlapaz, Sr.
Science Research Specialist also added some knowledge
through his lecture on “Practical Sugarcane Cultivation.” Ditto
for Ms. Dyna Tienda, Science Research Specialist who
tackled the topic on “The Process of Milling Cane into
Sugar.” She shared that SRA has no power to impose
penalties on environmental concerns, only to assist and
deliver services.
Before the program came to a wrap, the SRA pool of
speakers staged a mini-consultation among the participants
for their needs assessment. In the end, the following factors
cropped up: farm mechanization (120 horse power tractor),
implements (mould, board), High-Yielding Varieties,
harvester (sickle bar, hauling truck, cane loader), livelihood/
alternative source of income (muscovado production), soil
analysis, water management (irrigation, drainage), fertilizer,
retooling seminars, presence of Extension monitoring team
and accreditation.- Joseph Peter R. Gonzales
- 5 Jul –Sep 2018
farmland and fabricator of plow and other farm implements in
Talon, Tuy, Batangas. He together with his cousins helped in the
farm activities in the field such as weeding, cultivation and
harvesting as well as delivering sugarcane using a cart into the
rails connecting to the mill. He obtained knowledge in sugarcane
farming practices through these routine activities in the field during
his childhood. He also got the idea of how entrepreneurship works
through his grandmother by accompanying her in the market to sell
various fruits such as banana, sineguelas and mango. He also
helped his grandfather, every after class in school by gathering
forages for pasture of their domesticated goats and cows.
During his college days, he became the chairman of the Balayan
Bay Movement / Earth Savers’ Movement, which honed his
leadership skills. They organized four high school youth
organizations in Balayan which were tied up in different farmers’
organizations as well as fishermen and women groups that mainly
focused on Earth conservation. Also, he became the president of
the Electronics Society of Mapua, which really contributed to his
leadership skills. He graduated with a degree of BS ECE in the
year 1994. In 1998, he got married to his high school classmate,
Ma. Maidess Panganiban who worked in the HR Department of
Globe Telecom. They were blessed with two beautiful daughters
and a son. He already taught his children the essence of education
and establishing their own business afterwards as their mind set,
not working as an employee; and with that he can see that maybe
in due time her eldest may engage in handling his farm if she
wished, while his son seems wanting to open his own restaurant
someday.
Through his savings, he started venturing in Agriculture in the year
2000 upon acquiring an initial land of five (5) has, located in Talon,
Tuy (two hectares) and Palincaro, Tuy, Batangas (3 hectares).
During that time, his mother was helping him in managing his
farmland since he was working as a Project Manager of Nokia
Philippines, Inc. in Makati City, where he was connected from 1998
until 2002. He initially planted papaya, calamias and sweet corn
which are the high value crops that time. When he worked in South
Post BELS of Bauan, Batangas, as an Assistant General Manager
from 2002-2003, a fishpond was established in his land property.
He then acquired another piece of sugarcane land in 2013 in San
Jose, Batangas. In this he started using organic fertilizer
formulation and potassium humate mixed with 21-00-00 fertilizer.
His brother who is working in the mill also helped him in mudpress
provision for formulation of organic fertilizer. He sold this land later
on to someone engaging in poultry business. He then started
engaging into poultry in 2013 as part of his farm in Talon, Tuy
which he acquired by that year in exchange of his area in San
Jose.
By then, an Accenture company technician, a distributor of
hypercompost consulted him and offered their product for a lower
price in exchange of promoting their product through the
establishment of a demo farm in his area. Through this agreement,
he with the help of his farm workers got motivated even more to
organize the system of sugarcane farming in his area. He was able
to expand his farmland when he bought another sugarcane area of
6.5 hectares in Acle, Tuy. Upon searching of HYVs which are
highly adaptable in his area and has good ratooning quality, he
observed that PHIL 99-1793 turned to be outstanding as compared
to other varieties he tried such as the 2000 Series, so until the
present almost his entire sugarcane area is planted with PHIL-99
variety, also PHIL 7544.
In 2017, he was elected Board of Director of the Batangas
Sugarcane Planters Cooperative Marketing Association. Prior to
his basic knowledge from his early years and also those acquired
in attending seminars in relation to farming, he was able to equip
himself on what he thought should uplift the quality of his
sugarcane produce. Aside from using the formulation of organic
fertilizer containing mudpress, mill ash, effective microorganisms,
and chicken manure sustained from his poultry farm, and other
fertilizer input including potassium humate mixture with 21-00-00
fertilizer, other recommended practices such as deep plowing and
double row system of planting using 6 lacsa/ha of HYV were
adapted. Unlike when he was starting-up on his farm, using
traditional practices such as 3 lacsa/ha of old and deteriorating
canepoints, and around 1 meter furrow distance was considered to
be a good foundation and still he was able to improve given the
new technologies that he didn’t hesitate to adapt, leading to a
higher yield. Other farmers in the community as well as other
members of BSPCMA started to use his technology to attain better
yield.
He was also able to provide assistance to his farm workers in
terms of provision of farm housing, group insurance, social
amelioration bonus, financial assistance and motor vehicle
assistance. A wild pig production was also established in his farm
for sustainable source of food for his workers. Aside from that, he
also has rental properties and trucking services (2 dump trucks, 2
six wheelers) as other income-generating activities. As an
entrepreneur, Engr. Arnel can consider himself as a person who is
not afraid to take the risk. He always sets his mind on his guiding
principle, which is to provide food for the people and inspire
people/ farmers like him not to fear taking risk, that there is
success in sugarcane farming.—Joseph Peter Gonzales
2018 Gawad Saka …. from p. 1
- 6 Jul –Sep 2018
FMR INSPECTION CONDUCTED
One of the problems affecting farmers is the farm-to-
mill road, the reason why SRA always thinks of ways
and means to address such issue. In an effort to help the
plight of the farmers, the agency came up with a farm-
to-mill road project that started in 2016.
With this
thought, on
July 6, 2018,
the SRA’s Mr.
Wilfredo
Mapano and El
Mark
Jakosalem,
together with
the Department
of Public Works and Highways (DPWH) engineers and
BMDDFI Manager Mr. Melbert Arayan conducted a
pre-final inspection of the 2016 Farm-to-Mill Road
(FMR) project at Oadi, San Jose and Crossing Bida to
Lumintao, Quezon, Bukidnon.
Said inspection aimed that all the roads connected with
the project are in place. This project just showed that
SRA wants to give what is best for the farmers like easy
road access.
The Farm-to-Mill-Road is one of the many projects of
SRA for the betterment and welfare of its clientele.
With the dedication of the agency, it will definitely
continue to live its purpose for the success of the
farmers in the sugarcane industry.
FLT TRAININGS HELD
The Sugar Regulatory Administration (SRA) facilitated
seminars on Financial Literacy and OPSI trainings on
July 10-13, 2018 at the Yhoni Café, Musuan, Maramag,
Bukidnon. Said seminars came in batches. The first
batch (July 10-11, 2018) had 32 participants (14 males
and 18 females) while the second one (July 11-12,
2018) had 30 participants (18 males and 12 females).
Such trainings were for applicants of the Socialized
Credit Program, being one of the requirements.
The purpose of the seminars was to educate the small
sugarcane farmers to be responsible and wise in
handling money.
Said trainings were successful with the active
participation of the farmers, who were very eager,
willing and interested to learn about the program. They
listened intently to the lectures and discussions and
later participated in the question and-answer portion at
the end of each topic.
Over-all, the participants went home feeling
accomplished with the knowledge and insights they
gained from the seminars like financial independence
and freedom, money management, determination,
patience, and hard work.
CHED MEETS SRA SCHOLARS
On July 19, 2018, the CHED staff flew to Bukidnon to
meet the scholars under the SRA-SIDA scholarship
program. The purpose of the visit was to address the
concerns and answer the questions of some of the
scholars under the program. Some SRA personnel were
also present in the occasion like Ms. Belle Plaza, Ms.
Josephine Mapano, Mr. Ismael Braga, and Mr. El Mark
Jakosalem.
During the meeting, the scholars raised some vital
points and concerns about the program, which the
CHED and SRA staff answered to the best of their
ability. Said meeting was a success in the sense that all
major concerns were clearly tackled.
SUGARCANE PRODUCTION
SEMINAR HELD The Crystal Sugar Company, Inc. sponsored and
organized a Sugarcane Production Technology seminar
on July 25 and September 13, 2018. This was
conducted at Comara, Amai Manabilang, Wao, Lanao
Del Sur (July 25, 2018) with 165 participants. The same
seminar was held at Malipayon, Pangantucan,
Bukidnon (September 13, 2018) with 203 participants.
The topics presented during said activities include,
“Land Preparation” and “Harvesting and Ratooning.”
The seminars aim to educate the farmers on the new
technological trends in sugarcane farming, the various
high-yielding varieties, and how to increase
productivity with less cost. In this way, the farmers will
- 7 Jul –Sep 2018
become more effective and efficient with their
sugarcane production.
Interestingly, at the end of one of the seminars, one
participant gave an impression and he conveyed his
gratitude and appreciation to the Sugar Regulatory
Administration and Crystal Sugar Company, Inc. for
bringing the technology at their doorstep.
SRA AND BUSCO CONDUCT JOINT
FIELD VALIDATION
SRA Field Surveyors Servillano Longakit, Carloweh
Blanco, and Francis Ucat along with BUSCO Crop
Inspector Mr. Ryan Sala paid a visit to a new area of
sugarcane located in Brgy. Basok, Kawayan, Tapulan,
Talakag, Bukidnon on July 26, 2018.
The purpose of the visit was to validate the place
whose estimated area is more or less 100 hectares.
This activity was made possible through the efforts
given by the BUSCO, which assisted the farmers in the
expansion of their farms. It was observed that although
their farm areas were far from the mill site, the soil of
their farm is fertile and productive.
SRA STAGES INCEPTION MEETING
Senior Agriculturist Mr. Adel Catuira along with Ms.
Anna Marie Agor of SRA Quezon City conducted an
inception meeting with the Bukidnon MDDC and
association managers on August 7, 2018. The purpose
of the visit was to discuss the Rapid Propagation
Project.
Mr. Catuira explained that the concerned MDO’s and
different
districts
already
submitted
the listings
of possible
sources of
planting
materials
together
with the
names and
addresses of the contact persons & the varieties so that
the Commission On Audit (COA) could check the
authenticity of the suppliers. He also cleared that if the
project would not be implemented in 2018, the budget
will return to SRA. The liquidation process was
discussed as well and the body amended the format of
the work and financial plan for revision according to
their activities.
In his discussion, Mr. Catuira pointed out the main
reason why the project got delayed and it was because
of the procurement process especially, with the
requirements set by the COA. He also informed the
MDDC officer that the project is already moving and
continuing.
SRA-TESDA SCHOLARS RECEIVE
ALLOWANCE AND CERTIFICATES
August 8, 2018 marked a red-letter day for the SRA-
TESDA scholars as they received their allowance and
certificates at the SRA Bukidnon office. There was a
total of 49 Automotive NC I scholars who personally
went to the place to receive their due, so to speak.
Indeed, said scholarship program draws huge
inspiration. It is able to help less privileged but
deserving students. Although it is true that it is not all
bed of roses for the scholars since they face various
challenges in the process, it still proved to be a
gratifying endeavor.
In addition, it was a challenge consolidating all
- 8 Jul –Sep 2018
NEW OPERATIONS MANAGER FOR
CARSUMCO
CARSUMCO has a new Operations Manager in the
person of Ms. Ma. Mitzi V.
Mangwag. She assumed the post
on August 27, 2018 replacing
outgoing Operations Manager
Atty. Joseph E. Tan.
As the new Operations Manager,
Ms. Mangwag is mandated to
direct and oversee the operational
activities of URC Sugar Division-CARSUMCO. She
shall promote a high standard of manufacturing
operations, product quality and safety requirement to
continuously improve the overall performance of the
company. She shall also manage the utilization of
equipment, facilities, budget and personnel to
effectively achieve key performance indicators.
Furthermore, she vowed to have good partnership with
concerned agencies, LGU’s and especially the planters
to increase production and improve productivity in the
district.
Mitzi started her career in March 1988 as Internal
Auditor of the Universal Robina Sugar Company
(URSUMCO) based in Negros Oriental. In April 1991,
she was assigned in URC-CARSUMCO at Sto.
Domingo, Piat, Cagayan as Internal Audit in Charge
and later became the Chief Accountant in September
1997.
Due to her outstanding performance, she was promoted
as Group Head for Warehousing and Logistics across
all Sugar and Renewable in November 2007 which is
based in Negros Oriental until she resigned.—Lito
Caranguian
pertinent documents needed for the scholarship but
with the joint effort of the scholars and the TESDA-
SRA staff, everything fell into the right place.
AN INSPIRING TALK ON THE BLOCK
FARMING PROGRAM
On September 21, 2018, the Bukidnon Sugar
Company (BUSCO) invited Senior Agriculturist
Mr. Wilfredo A. Mapano to speak and discuss about
the Block Farming Program at Park Area, Wao,
Lanao del Sur.
The BUSCO organized the event because of the
participants’ interest and amazement on how the
program has helped and will still help small
sugarcane farmers.
Participants listened attentively to the talk and it
was evident that they gained lots of insights on
various techniques that could help them achieve
higher yield.
This undertaking is indeed a solid proof of SRA’s
commitment to help sugarcane farmers. Together
with the BUSCO, they are aware that one effective
way to cascade this is through educating them.