IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting October 28, 2014 –WEB only Approved Minutes Issued November 3, 2014; Published January 9, 2015 Chair Lorraine Padden called the meeting to order at 8:00 a.m. on October 28, 2014, at WEB online meeting. Agenda: An agenda item to review 8.4.3.6 online monitoring was added. A motion was made by Jim Bryan and seconded by David Bredhold to approve the agenda as amended. Meeting agenda was approved. Meeting Attendees: (See Attachment) Attendees were introduced on the WEB/telecon and attendance was taken. Minutes The minutes of the previous meeting September 23, 2014 were posted online and votes were taken of the voting members in person/web and using the ePoll feature of IEEE 3004.8 mentor site. The minutes need more votes for approval (reminder to vote online) and will be posted to the mentor site following approval. IEEE Patent Slides The IEEE Patent Slides were reviewed. No patent issues were brought forward by anyone in attendance. Care will be taken for the online monitoring to avoid product specific descriptions. PAR Scope, Purpose and Schedule Working Group was asked if there were any questions regarding the Par Scope, Purpose and Schedule. There were no questions. A Task Group meeting to review material for ASD and DC sections is scheduled for November 18; 8:00 am to 10:00 am. The general target is to complete the draft by December 2014, ballot the Working Group 4Q 2014 (3 week review), meeting December 9, invitation to ballot 4Q 2014, start formal balloting 1Q 2015, and submit to RevCom after Mid 2015. Based on formal ballot timing, a PAR extension will be needed. The Working Group requested information on signing up in myProject so they could get the invitation to ballot. This information is on the IEEE 3004.8 mentor site and is also attached to these minutes. Still pending is the request made by the Working Group to set up a one to two hour meeting with Lisa Perry of IEEE to step through the sign-up for invitation, accepting invitation, and balloting/commenting process. NOTE: to vote on this standard, sign up in myProject, respond to the invitation to ballot, and respond to formal ballot – vote & comment. (see attachment)

IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting October 28, 2014 –WEB only Old Business • Review Task List (see attached) The Task List was reviewed and updated. See attached. New Business • Status PAR Extension

Lisa Perry and Rasheek Rifaat submitted the PAR extension request prior to the October 20 deadline for the NecCom’s December meeting.

• Copyrights; NEMA, API, & IEEE

The copyright form needs to be sent to all persons contributing Figures and Tables. A list of Figures and Tables was added to the front of the standard. Copyright forms will be drafted and sent to the company representatives for completion of the documents.. Lisa Perry indicated that the copyrights should be in hand before the Mandatory Editorial Comments.

Jim Bryan and EASA’s contact with NEMA received positive feedback that IEEE 3004.8 could pursue copyrights with NEMA for some material proposed to include in IEEE 3004.8. Lorraine will work with Jim on the material proposed and coordinating the copyright release forms for NEMA.

Lorraine contacted Duane Brown at API regarding the vibration tables for 541. Their legal department has not finished reviewing and approving the final document. When this is available, the materials and copyright will be completed.

• Review 1-line & 3-line drawings Figs 7, 8, 18, 19, 36, 37 ; Bredhold

There were minorl comments on the 1-line and 3-line drawings. David Bredhold is in the process of incorporating those comments. The figures should be submitted in jpg so they are clearer in the draft for review by the Working Group. Drawing 7 will be updated & prepared by David Bredhold.

• Review 7.3.1 PTC curve, 5.2.5 starting Wye-Delta open & closed transition; Crook

The figures had minor comments and will be updated by Jim Crook. The NTC will be created and sent to Lorraine to include in the draft. (notes included in the Draft document).

• Review 5.2.7 Voltage source PWM starting ASD; 9.2.3 LV ASD ground fault protection for high resistance grounded systems (new) Padden

This new section was summarized from a 2013 PCIC paper. The consensus was to include this material along with the references.

IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting October 28, 2014 –WEB only

• Review 8.4.3.6 – Stator Insulation Monitoring; Bryan

The specific terms proposed by the submitter for online stator monitoring apply to specific product information. The WG consensus was to include the information in general (not product specific), move to Annex E, renumber Annex E as needed.

It was also the WG consensus to delete the PD information for off-line testing of cables because it was out of scope for Motor Protection.

• Review 9.2.3 LV ASD ground fault protection for high resistance grounded systems (new) Padden

This new section was summarized from a 2013 PCIC paper. The consensus was to include this material along with the references.

• Review comments, 6.3.1 Devices 46 & 47 CT & PT locations; Ransom

Dan Ransom prepared updated drawing showing the CT & PT location for devices 46 & 47 respectively. WG accepted the modification.

• DC Motor Protection, Bryan & Yung (EASA)

New material for the proposed DC Motor Protection sections was submitted for consideration by the WG. This material will be added to the draft and reviewed with the Working Group at the mini-meeting planned November 18 by the Task Group.

Next Meetings The next meetings were planned as follows: Mini-meeting for ASD review of Section 9.0, leader Jim Crook: November 18, 2014 Mini-meeting for DC Motor proection review, leader Jim Bryan; November 18, 2014 Web only meeting for Tuesday November 18, 2014. (purpose, complete the ASD & DC Motor proection section of the draft for Working Group Vote) ½ Day; 8:00 am – Noon Texas Time (may finish by 10:00 am, depending on discussion) Web only meeting for Tuesday December 9, 2014. (purpose, complete the draft for Working Group Vote) ½ Day; 8:00 am – Noon Texas Time A motion to adjourn was made by David Bredhold and seconded by Jim Bryan. Motion unanimously approved. The Meeting adjourned at 12:00 p.m. Lorraine K. Padden, Chair, IEEE P3004.8 Attachments: 3004.8 Task List, Meeting Attendees, & myProject signup instructions for invitation to ballot

IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting October 28, 2014 –WEB only

3004.8 TASK LIST

Section No. Description Lead/Group

General

Yellow highlights-references to old Buff book – decide if we reference old book and/or new standards that are in development. Same for other Color Book references.

- Are they needed - If so is there new reference - If not, keep old reference

Paul Cardinal Lorraine Padden

9. Develop ASD section Jim Crook-Lead, Jeff Hensley, Dan Neeser, Tim O’Hearn, John Kay

General Check NEMA references – plan for September December 2014 meeting Jim Bryan

8.4.5

Add NEMA vibration table, copyright; plan for August OctoberDecember 2014 meeting (inquiry sent to NEMA-Lisa Perry ask about MOU;)Jim inquired to NEMA – copyright contact person.”LKP to draft”

Jim Bryan; Padden

Get with Kurt LeDoux on LV ASD application- request made by lkp- August December meeting

Lorraine Padden

Get with Michael Noonan for LV ASD applications, December meeting

Lorraine Padden

5.2.1 to 5.2.4

Soft start, wye delta – some information added in D3.7; for April 2014 meeting- check w/John, David Solicit diagrams August October 2014; Jim Crook-diagrams; Updates for December 2014

John Kay, David Bredhold; Jim Crook; Louis Spence

GE Example, Bharat Mistry Lorraine Padden Check, overcurrent, overvoltage, undervoltage Lorraine Padden

Send Copyright-release to WG members/post on mentor site Lorraine Padden

9.1.2

Check with Barry Wood to see if API standards discuss ASD applications; - telecon June 13, 2013 Sent emails – follow-up w/API September 2014; October Duane Brown is still waiting on API Legal to release API 541.

Lorraine Padden

IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting October 28, 2014 –WEB only

Section No. Description Lead/Group

10 DC Motor – plan for September December 2014 Chris Heron, Jim Bryan, John Kay, Chuck Yung

11 DC ASD motor protection – plan for September December 2014 Overspeed; field loss; centrifugal switch & tach feedback; armature overcurrent; thermal protection

Chris Heron, John Kay, Jim Bryan, Chuck Yung

C37 Fig. 39 Prepare new C37 Fig. 39, ASD Zones of protection; added to D3.6; updated 3/2014; update August December 2014 use Dev. 11; keep 87M & 49

John Kay

C37 Fig. 40

Update Figure with transformer protection; update CT symbols Consult w/David Shipp on Transformer secondary configuration (ungrounded delta MV) and protection needed

Lorraine Padden

C37 Fig. 41 Update Fig. 41 to show internal protection matching Fig. 39; match symbols – December 2014

John Kay

C37 Fig. 44 Prepare V/Hz figure; added to D3.6; updated 3/2014; for V nominal – delete “nominal” John Kay

GE Bently-Nevada, vibration section; included in D3.6; need CR Provide updated text on vibration; provide references for stator monitor; provide pictures in jpeg, get CRights

Lorraine Padden

9.1.6 PTC Figure; October 2014 Jim Crook

5.2.1 add text on current and voltage and torque values; no frequency change; also graphs>

David Bredhold; Jim Crook

5.2 Contribute photos/graphs/diagrams of start methods Jim Crook

9.3.3 Request Working Group copy of IEEE C57.110 Perry/Padden

9.2.2 Multiple motors – plan for September 2014 NEC 430.130 & 131; check 3004.8 for more info

Jeff Hensley, John Kay

9.3.7 Need to add information for MV multiple motors, Jeff Hensley, John Kay>

IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting October 28, 2014 –WEB only

Ask for a Web session with Lisa Perry on how to sign up in myProject so the Working Group can get invite and ballot. Full “how to” session on sign up and ballot process.

Perry/Padden

general Solicit MPR (11M) pictures for document-August 2014 (Dan Ransom); October 2014 Vendors/users

9 PSP – request to use material from other standards; copyright release Dan Ransom;

Padden

Examples Develop Synchronous motor protection example for inclusion in Annex Dan Ransom,

Padden

IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting October 28, 2014 –WEB only Section No. Completed Task Description Lead/Group

General Check on VT or PT or both – VT, voltage (potential) transformer, add to abbreviations

Lorraine Padden

Fig 25 & 26 Prepare new Figures; added to D3.6; updated 3/2014 John Kay

Fig 27 Prepare bypass Figures for ASD; added to D3.6; updated 3/2014 John Kay

9.3.8.2 Partial discharge; Annex added to D3.6 from Renforth information; needs CR & review

Chris Heron, Macolm Seltzer-Grant

12.2 Class II; material from Singh added D3.6 for review

Chris Heron, Manish Singh

6.5.1 MV multifunction relay (move to end); Figures reviewed 3/25/2014 meeting; updated; added D3.7 David Bredhold

Annex B Insert Table of IEEE device numbers; added D3.6; John Kay

6.3.2 Fig. 2

Change direction of arrow, single-phasing diagram & change to 115% Jim Bryan

C37 Fig. 39 Conduct ePoll to determine if Working Group wants to use device 50/51 or device 11 – use Dev. 11; keep 87M & 49

Lorraine Padden

C37 Fig. 43 Update Fig 43 bypass Figures for ASD; show block diagram; use CT symbol; show NO/NC contacts with interlocks for bypass; show Dev 11 (Jim Crook complete May 2014)

John Kay, Jim Crook

References

Request Working Group copies from IEEE, Lisa Perry, for the reference documents and new 3000 series documents so we can clean up the references throughout the document – requested April 2014 (Perry posted to mentor site May 2014)

Lorraine Padden

8.4.1 Add stator overtemperature setting to text - plan for April 2014 meeting- Done-edited 4-22-2014

John Kay

General Check kW and hp; checking IEC & NEMA; spreadsheet reviewed June 2014 Jim Bryan

MV Add snubber information- stator winding protection, plan for July 2014 meeting

John Kay, Dave Bredhold

Copyright for thermocouple wire This section will be modified with references to the standards where copyright is not needed(8/2014)

Manish Singh

IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting October 28, 2014 –WEB only Section No. Completed Task Description Lead/Group

Fig w/Dev21

Update with voltage updated; jpeg; complete Sept 2014 Dan Ransom

8.6, 8.7 Review synchronous motor protection. Harmonize with B.2 and Table 6 and figures; complete Sept 2014 Dan Ransom

8.10, 8.11, 8.12

Review ; complete Sept 2014 Dan Ransom

8.4.3.6

Online stator insulation monitoring – check to see if the draft is keeping information generic for the standard and review wording so it does not limit to one product.MSIM. October 2014

Jim Bryan

Sponsor: IEEE/IAS/TBCC/3004 WGIEEE 3004.8 Working Group

Updated: October 28, 2014 lkp

NameE-mail (this is public information unless noted otherwise) Company Company Affiliation (if different) Designation

Attendance 10/28/2014

Working Group OfficersPadden, Lorraine paddeneng@aol.com Padden Engineering, LLC Padden Engineering, LLC Chair, Voting Member X

Working Group Membership

"Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems"

g p pAbdel Khalek, Mohamed mamohame@pgesco.com PGESCo PGESCo Aspirant Member

Alahmad, Mahmoud malahmad2@unl.edu

Ali, Mohammed Ashraf alimas@sabic.com SABIC E&PM Aspirant Member

Arcega, F arcegafj@unizar.es Universidad de Zaragoza University of Zaragoza Aspirant Member

Baird, Gregory gregory_baird@hotmail.com Jones & Carter, Inc. Jones & Carter, Inc. Aspirant Member

Bavishi, Smit smit@smitbavishi.com Hatch Mott MacDonald Hatch Mott MacDonald Non-Voting Member

Belayneh, Sirak sbelayne@addistech.com Addis Tech DC Water Voting Member Web

University of Nebraska-Lincoln

Bredhold, Robert David dbredhold@gmail.com C&I Engineering C&I Engineering Voting Member Web

Bryan, James jbryan@easa.com Voting Member WebCardinal, Paul paul.g.cardinal@shell.com Non-Voting Member

Carroll, James jamescarrollsr@cox.net Kelly Services, Inc. On assignment to the Dow Chemical Company

IEEE Member / Self Aspirant Member E

Crook, Jim jim.crook@schneider-electric.comSchneider Electric Schneider Electric Voting Member Web

Franklin, Jerry jbfranklin@pdengineers.com Engineers Inc Engineers Inc Non-Voting Member

Electrical Apparatus Service Association

Shell Global Solutions Inc.

Franklin, Jerry jbfranklin@pdengineers.com Engineers, Inc. Engineers, Inc. Non Voting Member

Hensley, Jeffrey jnh@freese.com Freese and Nichols, Inc Freese and Nichols, Inc Voting Member

Heron, Chris heronc@tecowestinghouse.com TECO-Westinghouse Motor Company

TECO-Westinghouse Motor Company

Voting Member

Hinchliffe, David david.hinchliffe@exeloncorp.com Exelon Corporation Exelon Corporation non-Voting Member

Hohrein, Byron bhohr1023@aol.com Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority Voting Member Web

JAIN, MAYANK iitd.mayank@gmail.com Steel Authority of India IEEE Member / Self Aspirant Member

Khan, Umar umarnaseem.khan@ge.com General Electric General ElectricKay John Voting Member EKay, John jakay@ra.rockwell.com Rockwell Automation Rockwell Automation Voting Member E

Kim, Sangyoun sykimk@gmail.com Bechtel Corporation Bechtel Corporation Aspirant Member

Kloba, Theodore kloba@sbcglobal.net CDM Smith CDM Smith Aspirant Member

Larsen, Ed ed.larsen@ieee.org Schneider Electric Schneider Electric Observer

Leschert, Duane duane.leschert@worleyparsons.com WorleyParsons, Ltd. WorleyParsons, Ltd. Aspirant Member E

Linenbrink, Timothy

tim_linenbrink@msn.comNorth American Engineering, PLLC

North American Engineering, PLLC

Aspirant Member

Mcalhaney Jr, John mcalhaney@ieee.org Solutions, LLC Aspirant Member

Mohd Saad, Ahmad fauzisd@gmail.com PETRONAS PETRONAS Aspirant Member

Neeser, Daniel dan.neeser@cooperindustries.com Eaton Corporation Cooper Bussmann, Inc. Non-Voting Member

Neubauer, Arthur neubaueras@aol.com Arseal Technologies Arseal Technologies Aspirant Member

O'Hearn, Timothy timohearn1@gmail.com Englobal Englobal Voting Member

Ostojic, Pero postojic0502@rogers.com Voting Member E

Ransom, Daniel Leland danra995@yahoo.com Voting Member

Scheffler, Timothy tscheffl@vt.edu U.S. Air ForceSeltzer-Grant, Malcolm malcolm@hvpd.co.uk HVPD Aspirant MemberSingh, Manish manishvikramsingh@yahoo.co.in Suzlon Energy Ltd. Suzlon Energy Limited Voting Member

Spence, Louis louis.spence@lcec.net Voting Member

Stewart, Bill billgstewart@chevron.com Chevron ChevronStrang Jr, Douglas proee@ieee.org S & S ENGINEERING, P.C. S & S ENGINEERING, P.C. Aspirant Member E

Teh, Liang Hean heantl@hotmail.com Siemens self funded Aspirant Member E

Thomasson, Mike wmthomasson@prodigy.net Burns & McDonnell Burns & McDonnell Voting Member

Valdes, Marcelo marcelo.valdes@ge.com

Verma, Sunil sverma@globalskm.com Sinclair Knight Merz Sinclair Knight Merz Voting MemberGeneral Electric Company (GE)

Lee County Electric Coop (LCEC)

, sverma@globalskm.com Sinclair Knight Merz Sinclair Knight Merz Voting Member

3004.8-Roster-10-28-2014.xlsx 3004.8 roster 1 of 2

Sponsor: IEEE/IAS/TBCC/3004 WGIEEE 3004.8 Working Group

Updated: October 28, 2014 lkp

NameE-mail (this is public information unless noted otherwise) Company Company Affiliation (if different) Designation

Attendance 10/28/2014

"Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems"

Working Group - InterestedBagby, Adam

abagby@lswphx.com LSW Engineers Arizona, Inc. LSW EngineersBapat, Ashvin

ashvin.bapat@ge.comGeneral Electric Company (GE)

General Electric Company (GE)

Basu, Partha partha.p.basu@exxonmobil.com ExxonMobil ExxonMobilBondeur, Michael bondeur@elecon.de Elektro-Consuling Elektro-ConsultingBoyce, Christina c.boyce@ieee.org Mentor Staff, Editor

Elgueta, Cristian cmelguet@gmail.com SG SCM SG SCMFox, Gary

gary.fox@ge.comGeneral Electric Company (GE)

General Electric Company (GE)

Goodman, Mark mark.goodman@ieee.org ConsultantGroves, Randall

r.groves@ieee.orgGrant County Public Utility District

Grant County Public Utility District

E

Hemmer, Michael michael.hemmer@worleyparsons.com WorleyParsons Group Self-fundedHietpas, Scott ExxonMobil ExxonMobilJublee, Sofyanshah sofyanshah@gmail.com

Lagree, James JamesLLagree@Eaton.com Eaton Corporation Eaton CorporationLord, Jeffrey jeffrey lord@siemens com Siemens Industry Inc Siemens Industry Inc, y jeffrey.lord@siemens.com Siemens Industry, Inc. Siemens Industry, Inc.Marchini, Gregory g.marchini@ieee.org Mentor Staff, Editor

Mcconnell, Michael mcmcplaya@gmail.com Dashiell Inc. Shermco Industries, Inc. Web

Murzaku, Edrin edrin_murzaku@ieee.org ENGINEERNeitzel, Dennis

AVO Training Institute, Inc. AVO Training Institute, Inc. Perry, Lisa l.perry@ieee.org Admin, Editor,

Raza, Shoukat raza.shoukat@gmail.com Saudi AramcoRempe Kenneth ken rempe@siemens com Si I d t I Si I d t IRempe, Kenneth ken.rempe@siemens.com Siemens Industry, Inc. Siemens Industry, Inc.Smith, Jeremy General Electric General Electric Smullin, Gary Smullin Engineering, Inc. ConsultantVira, Azim avira@orbisengineering.net Orbis Engineering Orbis Engineering

SponsorRifaat, Rasheek rasheek.rifaat@ieee.org Jacobs Engineering WG 3004 Chair, Observer

Carey Cook ccook@sandc.com S&C TBCC Chair, Observer

GuestsAndrew Burgess andrew.burgess@hvpd.co.uk HVPD

Brant Wilhelm brant.wilhelm@ge.com GE Bently-Nevada

Mark Snyder mark.snyder@ge.com GE Bently-Nevada

* Designation; Please note in attendance column if you request a change in designation.* Voting Member - votes on minutes and other Working Group ballots, active participation required* Non-Voting Member - does not vote, active participation required* Aspirant Member request to become a member of this Working Group and actively participate in this Standard development* Aspirant Member - request to become a member of this Working Group and actively participate in this Standard development.* Observer - receives Working Group information, membership is not requested.* Guest - does not receive Working Group information.X - attend in person; WEB - attend via web; Tele - attend via teleconference; E - excused absence

3004.8-Roster-10-28-2014.xlsx 3004.8 roster 2 of 2

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