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IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting June 10, 2014 – Houston, TX/WEB Approved Minutes Issued July 6, 2014, published July 9, 2014 Chair Lorraine Padden called the meeting to order at 8:00 a.m. on June 10, 2014, at Schneider-Electric in Houston, TX and WEB online meeting. Agenda: A motion was made by David Bredhold and seconded by Jim Crook to approve the agenda as amended. Meeting agenda was approved. Meeting Attendees: (See Attachment) Attendees were introduced in person and on the WEB/telecon and attendance was taken. Minutes The minutes of the previous meeting April 22, 2014 were posted online and votes were taken of the voting members in person/web and using the ePoll feature of IEEE 3004.8 mentor site. The minutes were approved and will be posted to the mentor site. IEEE Patent Slides The IEEE Patent Slides were reviewed. No patent issues were brought forward by anyone in attendance. PAR Scope, Purpose and Schedule Working Group was asked if there were any questions regarding the Par Scope, Purpose and Schedule. There were no questions. The general target is to complete the draft by August 2014, ballot the Working Group 3Q 2014, invitation to ballot 3Q 2014, start formal balloting 3Q 2014, and submit to RevCom before October 2014. The Working Group requested information on signing up in myProject so they could get the invitation to ballot. This information is on the IEEE 3004.8 mentor site and is also attached to these minutes. NOTE: to vote on this standard, sign up in myProject, respond to the invitation to ballot, and respond to formal ballot – vote & comment.
IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting June 10, 2014 – Houston, TX/WEB Old Business The Task List was reviewed and updated. See attached. New Business
8:00 am – Review Annex B to harmonize with C37.2; include 61850-7-4 The information in Annex B was reviewed and the Working Group consensus was to include 61850-7-4 in Annex B tables as shown in C37.2.
• Resolve conflicts in Typical motor protection functions (Table 6, Figures 3 & 4;, Figure 10 & 11; Figures 28 & 29; Annex B; discuss synchronous in Figures & Table B.2)
• Review MV Fused starter & Breaker starter 1 & 3-lines (Bredhold)
• Determine if both Filled Box and List Box examples should be included (Leschert comments)
The Filled Box method will be used for the MV starter samples. Table 6 and the Figures were reviewed and updated.
• Review Devices 49, 49S, 49R – Thermal & electronic overload; winding overtemperature
• 6.10; 7.1.1; 7.3; 8.4.1; 9.1.6; ( note old sections moved 9.2.2; 9.2.4)
The Working Group consensus was to distinguish between 49, 49S, and 49R throughout the document. The consensus of the Working Group was to leave the Thermal & electronic overload and winding overtemperature information in the various sections and not consolidate.
• Review 5.2; Motor starting; extracted material from Red Book (Padden)
• Solicit figures for 5.2 (photos or starting 1-lines)
Jim Crook will check for photos and figures for 5.2.
• Review comparison of C37.96 vs 3004.8 (Ali comments)
Comments were reviewed.
• Review HP vs Kw – spreadsheet – (Bryan)
The Working Group consensus was to use standard HP values and select a kW value that closely matches. The HP and kW values in the document were reviewed and the values adjusted to standard values as needed. .
IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting June 10, 2014 – Houston, TX/WEB
• Review ASD comments 9.1.5 filters & reactors (Crook)
The information in 9.1.5 was reviewed and accepted by the working Group.
• Other
The cable PD information should be moved to the PD Annex.
Next Meetings The next meetings were planned as follows: Web only meetings for Tuesday July 8, 2014 Plan 8:00 am – Noon. Web only meetings for Tuesday August 5, 2014. All-day; 8:00 am – 4:00 pm Texas Time A motion was made by David Bredhold and seconded by Louis. Motion unanimously approved. The Meeting adjourned at 2:45 p.m. Lorraine K. Padden, Chair, IEEE P3004.8 Attachments: 3004.8 Task List, Meeting Attendees, &
myProject signup instructions for invitation to ballot
IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting June 10, 2014 – Houston, TX/WEB
3004.8 TASK LIST
Section No. Description Lead/Group
General
Yellow highlights-references to old Buff book – decide if we reference old book and/or new standards that are in development. Same for other Color Book references.
- Are they needed - If so is there new reference - If not, keep old reference
Paul Cardinal Lorraine Padden
9. Develop ASD section Jim Crook-Lead, Jeff Hensley, Dan Neeser, Tim O’Hearn, John Kay
MV Add snubber information- stator winding protection, plan for July 2014 meeting
John Kay, Dave Bredhold
General Check NEMA references – plan for July 2014 meeting Jim Bryan
8.4.5 Add NEMA vibration table, copyright; plan for July 2014 meeting (inquiry sent to NEMA-Lisa Perry ask about MOU;)
Jim Bryan
Get with Kurt LeDoux on LV ASD application- request made by lkp- July meeting
Lorraine Padden
Get with Michael Noonan for LV ASD applications
Lorraine Padden
5.2.1 to 5.2.4
Soft start, wye delta – some information added in D3.7; for April 2014 meeting- check w/John, David Solicit diagrams June 2014; Jim Crook-diagrams
John Kay, David Bredhold
DC Motor protection, DC drives; - plan for June 2014 meeting John Kay
GE Example, Bharat Mistry Lorraine Padden Copyright for thermocouple wire Manish Singh Check, overcurrent, overvoltage, undervoltage Lorraine Padden
Send Copyright-release to WG members/post on mentor site Lorraine Padden
9.1.2 Check with Barry Wood to see if API standards discuss ASD applications; - telecon June 13, 2013 Sent emails – follow-up w/API July 2014
Lorraine Padden
IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting June 10, 2014 – Houston, TX/WEB
Section No. Description Lead/Group
9.3.8 Multiple motors – plan for June 2014 NEC 430.130 & 131; check 3004.8 for more info
Jeff Hensley, John Kay
10 DC Motor – plan for July 2014 Chris Heron, Jim Bryan
11 DC ASD motor protection – plan for July 2014 Chris Heron, John Kay
C37 Fig. 39 Prepare new C37 Fig. 39, ASD Zones of protection; added to D3.6; updated 3/2014; update July 2014 use Dev. 11; keep 87M & 49
John Kay
C37 Fig. 40
Update Figure with transformer protection; update CT symbols Consult w/David Shipp on Transformer secondary configuration (ungrounded delta MV) and protection needed
Lorraine Padden
C37 Fig. 41 Update Fig. 41 to show internal protection matching Fig. 39; match symbols John Kay
C37 Fig. 44 Prepare V/Hz figure; added to D3.6; updated 3/2014; for V nominal – delete “nominal” John Kay
GE Bently-Nevada, vibration section; included in D3.6; need CR Provide updated text on vibration; provide references for stator monitor; provide pictures in jpeg, get CRights
Lorraine Padden
9.1.6 PTC Figure Jim Crook
5.2.1 add text on current and voltage and torque values; no frequency change; also graphs> David Bredhold;
Jim Crook
5.2 Contribute photos/graphs/diagrams of start methods Jim Crook
9.3.3 Request Working Group copy of IEEE C57.110 Perry/Padden
9.3.7 Need to add information for MV multiple motors, Jeff Hensley, John Kay>
Ask for a Web session with Lisa Perry on how to sign up in myProject so the Working Group can get invite and ballot. Full “how to” session on sign up and ballot process.
Perry/Padden
IEEE/Industry Applications Society/Technical Book Coordinating Committee Protection & Coordination Working Group (IAS/TBCC/3004 WG) P3004.8 “Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems” Working Group Meeting June 10, 2014 – Houston, TX/WEB Section No. Completed Task Description Lead/Group
General Check on VT or PT or both – VT, voltage (potential) transformer, add to abbreviations
Lorraine Padden
Fig 25 & 26 Prepare new Figures; added to D3.6; updated 3/2014 John Kay
Fig 27 Prepare bypass Figures for ASD; added to D3.6; updated 3/2014 John Kay
9.3.8.2 Partial discharge; Annex added to D3.6 from Renforth information; needs CR & review
Chris Heron, Macolm Seltzer-Grant
12.2 Class II; material from Singh added D3.6 for review
Chris Heron, Manish Singh
6.5.1 MV multifunction relay (move to end); Figures reviewed 3/25/2014 meeting; updated; added D3.7 David Bredhold
Annex B Insert Table of IEEE device numbers; added D3.6; John Kay
6.3.2 Fig. 2
Change direction of arrow, single-phasing diagram & change to 115% Jim Bryan
C37 Fig. 39 Conduct ePoll to determine if Working Group wants to use device 50/51 or device 11 – use Dev. 11; keep 87M & 49
Lorraine Padden
C37 Fig. 43 Update Fig 43 bypass Figures for ASD; show block diagram; use CT symbol; show NO/NC contacts with interlocks for bypass; show Dev 11 (Jim Crook complete May 2014)
John Kay, Jim Crook
References
Request Working Group copies from IEEE, Lisa Perry, for the reference documents and new 3000 series documents so we can clean up the references throughout the document – requested April 2014 (Perry posted to mentor site May 2014)
Lorraine Padden
8.4.1 Add stator overtemperature setting to text - plan for April 2014 meeting- Done-edited 4-22-2014
John Kay
General Check kW and hp; checking IEC & NEMA; spreadsheet reviewed June 2014 Jim Bryan
Sponsor: IEEE/IAS/TBCC/3004 WGIEEE 3004.8 Working Group "Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems"
Updated: June 10, 2014 lkp
NameE-mail (this is public information unless noted otherwise) Company Company Affiliation (if different) Designation
Attendance 06/10/2014
Working Group OfficersPadden, Lorraine [email protected] Padden Engineering, LLC Padden Engineering, LLC Chair, Voting Member X
Working Group MembershipAbdel Khalek, Mohamed [email protected] PGESCo PGESCo Aspirant Member
Alahmad, Mahmoud [email protected]
Ali, Mohammed Ashraf [email protected] SABIC E&PM Aspirant Member
Arcega, F [email protected] Universidad de Zaragoza University of Zaragoza Aspirant Member EBaird, Gregory [email protected] Jones & Carter, Inc. Jones & Carter, Inc. Aspirant Member
Bapat, Ashvin
[email protected] Electric Company (GE)
General Electric Company (GE)
Non-Voting Member
Bavishi, Smit [email protected] Hatch Mott MacDonald Hatch Mott MacDonald Non-Voting Member
Belayneh, Sirak [email protected] Addis Tech DC Water Voting Member WebBredhold, Robert David [email protected] C&I Engineering C&I Engineering Voting Member WebBryan, James [email protected] Voting Member WebCardinal, Paul [email protected] Non-Voting Member
Carroll, James [email protected] Kelly Services, Inc. On assignment to the Dow Chemical Company
IEEE Member / Self Aspirant Member
Crook, Jim [email protected] Electric Schneider Electric Voting Member Web
Fox, Gary
[email protected] Electric Company (GE)
General Electric Company (GE)
Franklin, Jerry [email protected] Engineers, Inc. Engineers, Inc. Non-Voting Member
Hensley, Jeffrey [email protected] Freese and Nichols, Inc Freese and Nichols, Inc Voting Member
Heron, Chris [email protected]
Companyg
Company Voting Member
Hinchliffe, David [email protected] Exelon Corporation Exelon Corporation Voting Member
Hohrein, Byron [email protected] Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority Voting Member EJAIN, MAYANK [email protected] Steel Authority of India IEEE Member / Self Aspirant Member
Kay, John [email protected] Rockwell Automation Rockwell Automation Voting Member EKim, Sangyoun [email protected] Bechtel Corporation Bechtel Corporation Aspirant Member
Kloba, Theodore [email protected] CDM Smith CDM Smith Aspirant Member
Lagree, James [email protected] Eaton Corporation Eaton Corporation Aspirant Member
Larsen, Ed [email protected] Schneider Electric Schneider Electric Observer
Leschert, Duane [email protected] WorleyParsons, Ltd. WorleyParsons, Ltd. Aspirant Member
Linenbrink, Timothy
[email protected] American Engineering, PLLC
Aspirant Member
Mcalhaney Jr, John [email protected] Solutions, LLC Aspirant Member
Mohd Saad, Ahmad [email protected] PETRONAS PETRONAS Aspirant Member
Neeser, Daniel [email protected] Cooper Bussmann, Inc. Cooper Bussmann, Inc. Non-Voting Member
Neubauer, Arthur [email protected] Arseal Technologies Arseal Technologies Aspirant Member
O'Hearn, Timothy [email protected] Self Voting Member
Ostojic, Pero [email protected] General Electric Company (GE) Aspirant Member ERansom, Daniel Leland [email protected] Basler Electric Company Basler Electric Company Voting Member
Scheffler, Timothy [email protected] U.S. Air ForceSeltzer-Grant, Malcolm [email protected] HVPD Aspirant MemberSingh, Manish [email protected] Suzlon Energy Ltd. Suzlon Energy Limited Voting Member
Spence, Louis [email protected] Voting Member WebStewart, Bill [email protected] Chevron ChevronStrang Jr, Douglas [email protected] S & S ENGINEERING, P.C. S & S ENGINEERING, P.C. Aspirant Member ETeh, Liang Hean [email protected] Siemens self funded Aspirant Member
Thomasson, Mike [email protected] Burns & McDonnell Burns & McDonnell Voting Member
Valdes, Marcelo [email protected] Aspirant Member
Verma, Sunil [email protected] Sinclair Knight Merz Sinclair Knight Merz Voting Member E
University of Nebraska-Lincoln
Electrical Apparatus Service Association
Shell Global Solutions Inc.
Lee County Electric Coop (LCEC)
General Electric Company (GE)
3004.8-Roster-6-10-2014.xlsx 3004.8 roster 1 of 2
Sponsor: IEEE/IAS/TBCC/3004 WGIEEE 3004.8 Working Group "Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems"
Updated: June 10, 2014 lkp
NameE-mail (this is public information unless noted otherwise) Company Company Affiliation (if different) Designation
Attendance 06/10/2014
Working Group - InterestedBagby, Adam
[email protected] LSW Engineers Arizona, Inc. LSW EngineersBasu, Partha [email protected] ExxonMobil ExxonMobilBondeur, Michael [email protected] Elektro-Consuling Elektro-ConsultingBoyce, Christina [email protected] Mentor Staff, Editor
Elgueta, Cristian [email protected] SG SCM SG SCMGoodman, Mark [email protected] ConsultantGroves, Randall [email protected]
y yDistrict
y yDistrict
Hemmer, Michael [email protected] WorleyParsons Group Self-fundedJublee, Sofyanshah [email protected]
Lagree, James [email protected]
Lord, Jeffrey [email protected] Siemens Industry, Inc. Siemens Industry, Inc.Marchini, Gregory [email protected] Mentor Staff, Editor
Mcconnell, Michael [email protected], Edrin [email protected] ENGINEERPerry, Lisa [email protected] Admin, Editor,
Raza, Shoukat [email protected] Saudi AramcoRempe, Kenneth [email protected] Siemens Industry, Inc. Siemens Industry, Inc.
Vira, Azim [email protected] Orbis Engineering Orbis Engineering
SponsorRifaat, Rasheek [email protected] Jacobs Engineering WG 3004 Chair, Observer
Carey Cook [email protected] S&C TBCC Chair, Observer
GuestsAndrew Burgess [email protected] HVPD
Brant Wilhelm [email protected] GE Bently-Nevada
Mark Snyder [email protected] GE Bently-Nevada
* Designation; Please note in attendance column if you request a change in designation.* Voting Member - votes on minutes and other Working Group ballots, active participation required* Non-Voting Member - does not vote, active participation required* Aspirant Member - request to become a member of this Working Group and actively participate in this Standard development.* Observer - receives Working Group information, membership is not requested.* Guest - does not receive Working Group information.
3004.8-Roster-6-10-2014.xlsx 3004.8 roster 2 of 2
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Recommended Practice for Motor Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power SystemsIAS/TBCC/3004 WG/P3004.8
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Recommended Practice for the Protection of Power Transformers Used in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems
IAS/TBCC/3004 WG/P3004.9
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Recommended Practice for Generator Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power SystemsIAS/TBCC/3004 WG/P3004.10
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Recommended Practice for Bus and Switchgear Protection in Industrial and Commercial Power Systems
IAS/TBCC/3004 WG/P3004.11
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