DIFFERENCES EXPLAINED

3 IITians Who couldn’t make it to the cover page of TIME

PREFACE PEOPLE HAVE ALWAYS FAILED TO UNDERSTAND WHAT ENTRANCE EXAMS ARE. ENTRANCE EXAMS REQUIRE ANALYTICAL ABILITY & HIGH LEVEL REASONING ABILITY. BOARDS REQUIRE ONLY MEMORY - IF U DON'T AGREE WITH THIS, THEN U DON'T KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A FACT & A CONCEPT. PERHAPS U R A MUGGER! GO THRU THIS & U'LL KNOW Y MORE THAN 70% IIMites R ENGINEERS FROM IITs, BITS, NITs, DCE etc. TELL US Y THE PERCENTAGE OF IITians IN TOP B-SCHOOLS LIKE ISB,IIMs AND FOREIGN B-SCHOOLS LIKE KELLOG, WHARTON IS MORE THAN DELHI UNIVERSITY STUDENTS? THE ANSWER IS SIMPLE - DU STUDENTS WERE SELECTED ON THE BASIS OF THEIR MUGGING SKILLS & IITians ON THE BASIS OF ANALYTICAL ABILITY. THIS DOES NOT COMPLETELY RULE OUT THAT DU STUDENTS AREN'T INTELLIGENT. COMPANIES GO FOR CAMPUS SELECTION TO THOSE INSTITUTES WHICH HAVE DIFFICULT SELECTION PROCEDURES. AIEEE & BITSAT ALSO REQUIRE ANALYTICAL ABILITY. FIRST YOU SHOULD UNDERSTAND WHAT IIT-JEE & OTHER ENTRANCE EXAMS ARE & THEN READ COMMENTS OF SOME PEOPLE FROM THE TIMES OF INDIA WEBSITE. THE LAST PART IS HIGHLY INTERESTING. THE SYLLABI OF ENTRANCE EXAMS R ENTIRELY DIFFERENT FROM BOARDS – MOST TOPICS ARE FROM BSc & MSc BUT THEIR LEVEL IS SUCH THAT EVEN DEANs OF MOST UNIVERSITIES CAN’T SOLVE THEM. OBVIOUSLY, MOST SCHOOL TEACHERS CAN’T. PEOPLE WHO SAY THAT IIT-JEE SHOULD BE STOPPED R THOSE WHO COULDN’T CLEAR IT OR THEIR KIDs COULDN’T – SO DON’T LISTEN 2 THEM. COACHING FROM A GOOD INSTITUTE IS HIGHLY RECOMMENDED. ENROLL YOURSELF IN A SCHOOL WHERE U DON’T NEED 2 ATTEND IT. STUDY FOR AT LEAST 7 HOURS/DAY – 9 SHOULD B FINE. BOARDS ARE NOT A CRITERIA FOR INTELLIGENCE, THEY TEST YOUR MEMORY. 27 AUGUST 2008

INTRODUCTION FROM WIKIPEDIA - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Institutes_of_Technology Admission to undergraduate programs in all IITs is tied to the Joint Entrance Examination, popularly known as IIT-JEE. Candidates opting for the B.Arch. (Bachelor of Architecture) program in IIT Kharagpur, and the B.Des. (Bachelor of Design) program in IIT Guwahati, have to clear an aptitude test as well. Candidates who qualify admission via IIT-JEE can apply for admission in B.Tech. (Bachelor of Technology), Dual Degree (Integrated Bachelor of Technology and Master of Technology) and Integrated M.Sc. (Master of Sciences) courses in IITs, IT-BHU and ISM Dhanbad. IIT-JEE is a science-oriented entrance exam, testing candidate's knowledge of mathematics, physics and chemistry. It is conducted by an IIT chosen by a policy of rotation. Admission is very competitive, given the huge population of India; the undergraduate acceptance rate through JEE has a low ratio (around 1 in 60) with about 300,000 annual test takers for about 5,500 seats. It is the toughest exam in the world. Only about 4,000 of these seats are offered by IITs, the rest belonging to other institutes that use IIT-JEE. Only students who have completed their 12th and secured at least 60% in their exam (higher secondary studies from a recognised educational board) are allowed to appear for IIT-JEE. The IIT-JEE is well known for frequently changing the types of questions asked in order to discourage study by rote. Since IIT-JEE 2006, the format of the question paper was changed to a single objective test-based paper, replacing the earlier system that employed two tests. The candidates belonging to the general category must secure a minimum aggregate of 60% marks in the qualifying examination of the XIIth standard organised by various educational boards of India. Candidates belonging to Scheduled Caste (SC), Scheduled Tribe (ST) and Physically Disabled (PD) categories must secure a minimum aggregate of 55% in the qualifying examination. The upper age limit for appearing for the IIT-JEE is 25 years. The age limit is relaxed to 30 years for candidates classified in the SC, ST and PD categories. Starting with IIT-JEE 2007, a candidate can take IIT-JEE a maximum of two times, and students who are selected for an IIT cannot attempt the examination again. Students select their institute and department of study based on what is available at the time of their counselling and interview that follows the IIT-JEE result. The interviews are usually spread over five days. The admissions into the postgraduate programmes are made through various exams, primarily the Graduate Aptitude Test in Engineering (GATE) for Ph.D., M.Tech., and some MS courses. This exam tests the conceptual clarity in technical subjects and is one of the most difficult in the country.Other prominent entrance exams include JAM (Joint Admission to M.Sc.) for M.Sc., and JMET (Joint Management Entrance Test) for Management Studies.

EDUCATIONAL RANKINGS Most IITs are consistently ranked above other engineering colleges in India in engineering education surveys,with regard to quality of faculty, teaching standards, research facilities and campus placements. In international surveys, the IITs achieve top rankings. The Times Higher Education Supplement (2005)ranked the IITs in the top 3 world universities. The IITs performed better in the Technology category of rankings. IIT Bombay and IIT Delhi were ranked 33rd and 37th respectively in the Technology category. In the Shanghai Jiao Tong University's Academic Ranking of World Universities, only one IIT (IIT Kharagpur) was listed among the top 500 universities worldwide. The IITs fall short in many parameters that are considered for educational rankings. The criteria for ranking prominently include internationally recognised research output, in which the IITs do not achieve notable success. Another criterion being the Social Science Citation Index, the rank of IITs suffers as they do not have large departments of liberal arts and social sciences. Since the IITs have only a few international faculty and students (except those by exchange programs), the rankings of IITs in many international surveys have suffered. Since the IITs have scored better under most educational ranking criteria than other Indian colleges and universities, they continue to achieve top positions in nationwide surveys. The Dataquest-IDC T-School Survey - 2008 1. IIT Kharagpur 2. IIT Delhi 3. IIT Roorkee 4. IIT Kanpur 5. IIT Guwahati 6. IIT Madras 7. International Institute of Information Technology, Hyderabad 8. Institute of Technology, Banaras Hindu University 9. NIT Calicut 10. Netaji Subhas Institute of Technology, New Delhi Among the criticisms of the IIT system by the media, academia and the people in general, the most prominent is that it encourages brain drain. Until the process of liberalisation started in early 1990s, India walted in large scale emigration of IITians to western countries, especially to the United States. Since 1953, nearly twenty-five thousand IITians have settled in the USA. Since the USA benefited from subsidised education in IITs at the cost of Indian taxpayers' money, critics say that subsidising education in IITs is useless. Others support the emigration of graduates, arguing that the capital sent home by the IITians has been a major source of the expansion of foreign exchange reserves for India, which, until the 1990s, had a substantial trade deficit. The extent of intellectual loss has receded substantially over the past decade, with the percentage of students going abroad dropping from as high as 70% to around 30% today. This is largely attributed to the liberalisation of the Indian economy and the opening of previously closed markets. Government initiatives are encouraging IIT students into entrepreneurship programs and are increasing foreign investment. Emerging scientific and manufacturing industries, and outsourcing of

technical jobs from North America and Western Europe have created opportunities for aspiring graduates in India. Many undergraduates go abroad to pursue further studies, such as MS and PhD.

ENTRANCE COMPETITION The highly competitive examination in the form of IIT-JEE has led to establishment of a large number of coaching institutes throughout the country that provide intensive, and specific preparation for the IIT-JEE for substantial fees. It is argued that this favours students from specific regions and richer backgrounds. Some coaching institutes say that they have individually coached nearly 800 successful candidates year after year. According to some estimates, nearly 95% of all students who clear the IIT-JEE had joined coaching classes. The psychological stress and emotional trauma faced by candidates not able to pass the examination and their families is considered to be a serious problem. This has led to criticism of the way the examinations are conducted. The IIT-JEE format was restructured in 2006 following these complaints.

THE TIMES OF INDIA NEWS

CANADIAN PASTURES OPEN FOR IITians

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/591965.cms KOLKATA: Students of IIT Kharagpur have a new world open to them. The institute signed an MoU with the University of Waterloo, Canada, on Tuesday for student and faculty exchange programmes in the field of electronics engineering, photonics and bio-sciences. A delegation of 12 Canadian universities, apart from Waterloo University, visited the IIT campus for the signing of the agreement. The team has toured IIT-Delhi and will be visiting IIT Chennai shortly. "We will draw up a term sheet within six months identifying areas in which we need to collaborate," said S.K. Dubey, director of IIT Kharagpur. The tie-up is being facilitated by the Canadian part of Tata Consultancy Services."India is a technology giant and institutes like the IITs can be compared with the best in the world. Hence, we are looking forward to a long and fruitful collaboration with it. Student and faculty exchange will benefit both of us," said A. Chakma, vice president (academic and provost) of the University of Waterloo. Chakma promised that some of the best scholarships would be given to exchange students who would visit University of Waterloo. Dubey pointed out that such collaborations are not new for IIT-Kgp, which already has tie-ups with leading foreign institutions like University of Washington, and Carnegie Mellon University. "We are focusing on research collaboration. We are keen on tie-ups so that we can share our best with the rest of the world, and get the best in return," Dubey said. The delegation was headed by Ravi Seethapathy, an alumnus of IIT Kharagpur. "The long term objective is to establish a solid science and technology exchange pipeline between India and Canada. This will benefit the private sector and universities in both countries," he said.

10k CRORE IIT COACHING INDUSTRY http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/India/IIT_coaching_classes_a_Rs_10k_cr_industry/articleshow/3190000.cms NEW DELHI: Coaching for admission to the IITs and other engineering colleges has acquired the status of a big industry in India. According to the Associated Chambers of Commerce and Industry, the size of the industry is Rs 10,000 crore. ASSOCHAM’s conclusion is based on the assumption that six lakh students attend these classes every year and the average cost for each student is Rs 1.7 lakh, a spokesman for the industry body told TOI. The staggering sum of Rs 10,000 crore being netted every year by private academies who coach students for admission tests can fund 30 to 40 new IITs,ASSOCHAM said. Calling for deregulation of higher education, ASSOCHAM president Sajjan Jindal said the beneficiaries of the current system were those running big educational institutions and coaching centres. "The amount of money which goes to these institutions is enough to open 30 to 40 IITs with lots of seats that can ensure admission to average candidates," he said.Those familiar with the coaching industry pointed out that both figures number of students going to coaching classes and the average cost per student seem exaggerated. The average cost per student cited by ASSOCHAM is too high, they said, pointing out that the cost in smaller cities which have many successful coaching institutes is much lower. They also said the number of students attending coaching classes could be much less than six lakh. TOI had recently done a survey of the coaching classes at Kota, the hub of the III-JEE coaching industry, and arrived at a ballpark figure of Rs 550 crore for the size of the industry there. At least 50% of the students who appear in the entrance tests for admissions to IITs and other engineering colleges enrol with coaching centres to beat the cutthroat competition, ASSOCHAM said. The industry body also said that 80,000-90,000 students go abroad for higher studies, leading to a high foreign exchange outflow. "If quality institutions are provided, a large number of students will stay back and contribute to the nation," ASSOCHAM said. It said that more institutions of excellence should come up and suggested that private players and big industrial groups should be encouraged in higher education. According to ASSOCHAM, India has over 12 million students in higher education but fewer than 350,000 faculty members.

MOVE OVER WHARTON, IIT IS HERE

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1529318.cms NEW DELHI: Brand IIT may have just got bigger. This year, for the first time, investment firms, which usually hire management graduates from Princeton, Wharton and MIT, were seen knocking on the doors of IIT Delhi to recruit engineering graduates for finance jobs. The annual pay packages are in the range of $60,000-100,000 . the same amount that a Wharton or MIT graduate for the same position would be offered. Out of the batch of 450, about 25 have got offers from I-banks like Merrill Lynch, PIMCO, Deutsche Bank, Goldman Sachs, UBS and Lehman Brothers. Rachit Jain,who has got an offer of $100,000 from Pacific Investment Management Company (PIMCO), is elated. "I had planned to do an MBA and only then was I expecting to be made such a lucrative offer. Had this not worked out, my career would have charted a different course.' Geetanjai Mittal, an associate with Merrill Lynch, said: "We usually hire students from MIT, Wharton and IIMs, and many of them have an IIT degree too. So this year, we decided that we might as well hire directly from IIT.' Students are essentially being hired for finance jobs . which have traditionally been considered the preserve of MBA students. "An MBA degree is not mandatory for these jobs.What's actually required are number-crunching skills which are well-possessed by these engineering students," added Mittal. What this also means is that many of these students have quit the idea of pursuing an MBA since it would be precisely for such jobs that they would want that degree. Akhilesh Chaudhary, who has got an offer from Merrill Lynch, has dropped plans to go to IIM Bangalore where he had been selected. "I've been offered an annual package of $60,000, plus a $10,000 sign-on bonus and performance-based incentives, and I'll most probably be posted in London or New York. So this just changes my career plans,' he says. Amit Aggarwal, who has been offered the position of an analyst at Merrill Lynch, says: "If I went into management after this, it would be because that would allow me to shift into finance. I had got a job with Google, Bangalore and after a few years of work experience, would have gone in for an MBA. Now all these plans appear to be pretty much redundant.'

B-SCHOOLS STATS Let us look at the academic backgrounds of B-school students IIM A STATS 2008 BATCH - 75% ENGG., 12% COMMERCE, 4% ARTS 2009 BATCH - 89%ENGG., 3% COMMERCE, 1% ARTS http://www.iimahd.ernet.in/recruitment/recruitment_student.htm#01

IIM B STATS 2008 BATCH 91% ENGG, 4% COMMERCE, 2% ARTS http://www.iimb.ernet.in/iimb/html/pgp-placement-batchprofile.htm IIM INDORE STATS http://www.iimidr.ac.in/iimi/pages/students/pgp0709-5.php BATCH 2009 JUST 10 STUDENTS FROM ARTS & COMMERCE IIM SHILLONG STATS http://www.iimshillong.in/participants-zone/participants-profile.asp Arts 0 Com/Mgmt 2 Engg/Tech. 58 Science 4 Total 64 Faculty of Management Sciences, DU has listed 99 students for summer internship for da batch of 2009. THEIR AVG SAL>15 LPA! http://www.fms.edu/placements/batchprofile2008ft.php?page=1 There r only 22 non-science Indians outta 99! 1 is MSc & da rest r engineers. 1 is a doc.

41% IIT-B STUDENTS GOT FINANCE & CONSULTING JOBS IN 2005

SO HERE COMES ANOTHER BIG PROOF – THE TIMES OF INDIA reported that 41% students of IIT-B in 2006 took FINANCE & Consulting jobs. Now the figure has increased. Link – http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Get_engineering__management_degrees_from_IIT-B/rssarticleshow/3334846.cms Companies like McKinsey, Goldman Sachs offers jobs to IIT graduates but not to DU graduates who graduate in B.Com., BA Economics even though their curriculum is business-related because they( the companies ) have understood the academic situation of India. We strongly feel that education policy makers should comprise of at-least 5 IITians, who have graduated after 1994. Selection procedure of Delhi University’s undergraduate program must be revised & should comprise of tests that judge logic & reasoning ability. The language courses can continue to take students on the basis of their mugging-quotient. We want only the best to be in front, don’t we?

REASON Some ppl will think y these engineers are being offered splendid jobs in FINANCE. The answer is simple – THEY CLEARED THE WORLD’S TOUGHEST EXAM based on analytical ability, reasoning & logic & they r thus VERY INTELLIGENT. The salaries offered 2 them r in many cases MORE THAN 16 TIMES THE HIGHEST SALARIES OFFERED TO DELHI UNIVERSITY GRADUATES, WHO’VE OBVIOUSLY LEARNT MORE ABOUT FINANCE THAN IITians. THE REASON IS THAT DELHI UNIVERSITY STUDENTS’VE BEEN SELECTED ON THE BASIS OF THEIR MUGGING ABILITY ( MARKS IN BOARDS EXAMS ). You can c the placement statistics & know the truth. MORE THAN 70% IIMites R ENGINEERS FROM ENGINEERING COLLEGES LIKE IITS, BITS, NITS & DCE ETC. Ppl fail 2 understand that boards require only mugging. THOSE WHO SAY THAT THEY’VE UNDERSTOOD THE SYLLABUS, THEY MUST KNOW THAT ENTRANCE EXAM SYLLABUS IS TOTALLY DIFFERENT & THAT BOARDS EXAM SYLLABUS IS SO EASY THAT ANY1 CAN UNDERSTAND IT. Mind you, memory is different from intelligence & there r many kids who r intelligent but don’t have good memories & hence don’t do well in school exams. We’ve met many of these kind. So it is very true that BOARDS ARE NOT A CRITERIA FOR INTELLIGENCE.

AIEEE SLANTS THE IIT-JEE WAY http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Cities/AIEEE_slants_the_IIT-JEE_way/articleshow/2989064.cms HYDERABAD: All India Engineering Entrance Examination (AIEEE) took students by surprise on Sunday with a fewer number of questions. It also followed the Indian Institute of Technology-Joint Entrance Examination (IIT-JEE)-2008 pattern with more applicative questions in both mathematics and physics sections. Though some were expecting it, many complained about the tough physics section in the paper. Generally physics, chemistry and mathematics sections have 40 questions each, but this year there were 35 each.The applicative questions, including paragraph questions, are comprehension type, while the assertion reasoning type questions test students on logic. "This pattern of questions force students to spend more time on each of them. But for students who have appeared for IIT-JEE the paper might look easy," TIME course director Vinod Iyer said. According to experts, as the number of questions have decreased and the number of candidates increased from the previous year, mistakes could be fatal. "When a student makes a mistake, it will have a major impact on his rank," TIME vice-president Ajay Antony told ‘TOI’.The number of students has increased from six lakh in 2007 to eight lakh in 2008. Meanwhile in the city, some students lost precious 30 minutes as they did not get hall tickets on time. "Though I had applied well in time, I did not get the hall ticket on the scheduled date. I did not get it even after applying again as per the instructions on the website," a student, who had come to attend the examination in the city, said. The student, a resident of Ranga Reddy district, said that he even got in touch with CBSE authorities in New Delhi, but in vain. About 25 students who did not get hall ticket were waiting around the examination centre while supervising officer took rounds to check the slips of their application forms and allowed them to write the examination. "We lost precious 30 minutes just because the CBSE officials were not responsible enough to make sure that the hall tickets reached us on time. Even after repeated representations, they did not take any action," a student, who is attempting the examination for the second time, said. The major institutes that select students through AIEEE exam are 20 National Institutes of Technology, five IIITs, 10 self-financed deemed universities, five central govt institutions and six state-level institutions.

CHANGING JEE

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1097044.cms

KOLKATA: Concerned over the immense stress that IIT-JEE puts on thousands of students, the Union HRD ministry has set up a high-level panel to modify the test pattern. Of the 1.5 lakh aspirants every year, only 3,500 make it to the seven IITs. To tone down the gruelling test, the ministry has formed a committee with teachers from IITs and representatives of the two +2 level national boards - CBSE and ICSE. According to sources, the first change may be to limit questions to the +2 syllabus. "The HRD ministry feels many of the IIT-JEE questions are based on topics that are not taught at the +2 stage, and are, in fact, of a far advanced standard. This forces candidates to start preparing at least three years in advance - from Class IX itself. They overload themselves and this leads to depression, which sometimes leads to suicides," IIT-Kharagpur director SK Dubey told TOI. Dubey and IIT-JEE chairman VK Tewari are on the committee, which is expected to submit its recommendations by July. The changes could be introduced from IIT-JEE, 2006. The government believes the tougher syllabus forces students to neglect their board examinations for IIT-JEE. They also end up spending a lot on coaching classes that claim to be tailor-made for the entrance test, said Dubey.

THE READERS’ OPINIONS ARE ON THE NEXT PAGE

TOI READER OPINIONS

The reason why IITs have big name not only in India but also internationally is it quality of the

students matched with the infrastructure. I question whether this plan of govt. might force to compromise one big reason for its success and accolades. Is it pertinent? I don’t think so... [4 May, 2005 | 1141 hrs IST] i guess this is not right to simplify the examination itself. the thing that causes stress is not the

syllabus rather its the competition to be in top 3000..over the years the level of JEE for IITs has kept it heads and shoulders above state entrance examinations and i guess the change in level of difficulty might erode the student base which IITs have because the present pattern tests more of analytical skills. its because of this that u find IITians excelling in all fields of life ..i hardly feel anything is out of syllabus as i have myself gone through all that... vikas [4 May, 2005 | 1050 hrs IST] I somewhat disagree with this step. The fact that the exam is difficult makes sure that only those

candidate get through who have good aptitude and understanding. Making it simpler would lead to the situation where a simple calculation mistake could risk the career of a student which is not there at the moment. [4 May, 2005 | 1048 hrs IST] The government is trying to make the same mistake, last Government tried to do by messing up

with IIM'! Have people ever thought "Why IITs are the best? not only in India but among the best in the world?". Its only due to its tough entrance examination. It ensures that only the best brains in the country reach the best of institutions. IIT's reputation will also drop down, if the standards of JEE go down! [4 May, 2005 | 1048 hrs IST] Neither Dubey, nor Tiwari went (rather were able to go)to IIT for their B.Tech. What else do you

expect from them? Ask the IITians of the 90s. The B.Techs have made the Indians proud - these morons are out to ruin that distinction by introducing mediocrity to the IIT B.Tech. system. [4 May, 2005 | 1002 hrs IST]

Take the toughness of the exam and take away the core substance that IIT's are made of. Being an IITan myself, I can tell you, it is not the faculty, not the facilities, not the staff that make IITs what they are today...it is only the tough entrance exam and the students who clear them. Studying for this exam is like tapasya....it builds character in the student and a keen interest in science. A coaching class is only an external stimulus to conduct the tapasya. A simpler exam means lesser tapasya...means lower standards...means lower success rate for everyone. Remember iron is cast only in fire. On a different note, even if the exam is made easier, it will neither lower the competition nor the existence of coaching centers. On the contrary it will only make it worse since you still have to select 2000 people out of 200000 based upon a simpler paper with little variation in grades. So now a bright guy goes to the examination hall and does a silly mistake and looses whereas a not so bright student puts in a random answer and gets successful. The frustrations will be endless here since many more students could have "solved the paper" but could not be successful....maybe more suicides. Finally I beleive, the test should be fair but should be such as to chose the best among the lot...since you want to provide the best facilities to a person who has shown past performance (like in the entrance exam). After al that is what human resource development is all about as far as IITs are concerned. How the people chose to update their qualities, e.g. through coaching classes, should be of no concern to the HRD ministry as far as IITs are concerned. There are a number of other engineering colleges for the less successful kids. Even if you look at how many people take coaching and how many are successful, the number ain't that high. It ultimately boils down to how somebody is able to utilize the resources that are given to them..which is again related to how past performance can be evaluated. The main trouble as I see it with policy makers is that of all the kids going to IIT almost all have had coaching. That is the nature of this game and you cannot change it unless you scrap the JEE altogether...which will lead to bigger problems than are currently at hand. Interestingly, neither anyone in the HRD ministry nor Dr. S.K.Dubey (proponents of making JEE easy) ever passed the exam themselves. I strongly suggest that there be people in the decision committee who have actually passed this exam themselves. Further they should constitute at least half of the committee. It is important since the people who make decisions know exactly what it is to clear JEE. [4 May, 2005 | 0943 hrs IST] shocking news, if something is working, I don't understand the urge to fix it! Please fix broken

issues first. Just because some people find it tough to get into the IIT's you can't make the exam easier!! the whole idea of an exam is to make it as tough as possible for the candidates, so that only the toughest get in! This sounds like the the left talking through the HRD ministry's mouth! [4 May, 2005 | 0923 hrs IST] I would believe this would be the dumbest move ever. A significant factor in the reputation, that

IIT has built up today, is the quality of students. Even in most grad Universities in US, almost all IITians have a superior edge over all the students, including the most Coveted universities like MIT (I am doing my PhD@ MIT and I can vouch for that). Lowering the standard would mean admitting people who can just excel by memorizing the routine questions asked in board exams. I think I learnt a lot when preparing for JEE, specially my mathematical skills. If the HRD ministry thinks that they can improve things, by reducing the standard of the exam, still their would be an equal

number of people who would not make through (and are more deserving) and they would commit suicide ..... This reasoning does not make any sense ... I hope that this does not happen [4 May, 2005 | 0827 hrs IST] At last the truth has come out of Horse's mouth. The IIT JEE syllabus has contents which are

not taught in the minimum specified qualification that is Plus 2. This syllabus rigging is what led to the mushrooming of Coaching Classes of the Brilliant kind including the evolution of the famous Kota Quota. The students who typically enter the IITs are over prepared and are mostly not 10 plus 2 but 10 plus 2 plus minimum 1 year of coaching. I wish someone does a Public Interest Litigation (PIL)accusing IITs of specifying an input level and conducting an entrance exam with syllabus of another level. It is an irony that the US Congress is heaping praise on the IIT system which has been taking the Indian Public for a Big Ride and the Indian Congress led ministry is raising an accusing finger at the same system. [4 May, 2005 | 0816 hrs IST] There we go DOWN THE DRAIN AGAIN. Current IITs are ahead of world standards already

which is creating wealth, reputation, glory & million times return in many ways. WHY REVERSE THIS ELITE CLASS TO TRASH QUALITY. WE HAVE ENOUGH OF SUCH COLLEGES ALREADY IN OUR COUNTRY? MANMOHANJI KUCH KARO INH NALAYAKONKO. NIKALO UNHA UNKHI PADHVI SE, PLEEEASE BEFORE WE START PRODUCING TRASHY IIT-IANS !!! [4 May, 2005 | 0448 hrs IST] Please do not compromise on quality for the sake of quantity. Its just because of the quality, that

IIT stands as a brand name. Please preserve and not degrade it!!!! [4 May, 2005 | 0437 hrs IST] Have these guys heard the proverb "if it ain't broke, don't fix it!". Why do they have to screw

around with the IIT System everytime? Having gone through the effort of cracking the JEE, an IITian is someone who's thought process and science/math aptitude is superior (in most cases but not all) than the rest of the bunch out there. Having taken the JEE myself, I know most of the questions are inspired by questions that are regularly fielded in the Russian Math & Science Olympiad exams. To "dumb-down" the exam would mean you are taking away from the aspirants, the once chance they will get to develop there thought process and thinking, beyond the regular study books. IIT is not for everyone...only someone who can handle the stress of JEE and the brutal 4 yrs after that. If they think the stress will reduce or people will stop taking coaching classes, they are mistaken. IIT is a selective process not an absolute process like Boards where you get get your %. [4 May, 2005 | 0116 hrs IST]

There seems to be a concerted effort to take advantage of brand IIT (this has been achieved through the hard work, immense effort, and the brawn of the past alumni) and then further water it down by making changes to the entrance exam. There was nothing wrong with the earlier format of just 1 set of exams. Then the 2-tier exam was created to make grading of papers easier. The first part i.e. the objective makes grading of papers faster...nothing wrong with that...however there is no need to change the later part. The events of the past few years seem to: a) Use the short term view of taking advantage of the Brand IIT name. This will only result in short term advantage…but the long term damage will be tremendous. Remember the Brand IIT was achieved internationally by the hard work and the above-average intellect of the past alumni. b) The above-average intelligent students were selected by one of the most rigorous exams…watering down the exam will have an opposite effect….this will eventually lead to a deterioration of standards…and eventually the demise of the Brand IIT! Finally, an observation of readers' comments although IIT is comparable to MIT and other top technical institutes. this comparison is only possible on the basis of students. If one uses other parameters, like faculty, infrastructure, research facilities etc., IIT will not stand a chance against the top technical institutes of the world. It is only the students (AND NOT ANY OTHER FACTOR), that makes Brand IIT what it is! If we change this parameter, then there will be an eventual destruction of the Brand IIT for the world judges the institute by the performance of its alumni and if we compromise that, there is nothing left. Agreed IIT will still be reputable because India does have good students, but it will no longer enjoy the status that it currently does. Of course I agree that there will be short term advantages for the students, but eventually well the writing is on the wall. [10 May, 2005 0517hrs IST] The most stupid thought ever!! Even more stupid are the suggestions from the readers to

increase intake and/or open more IITs. Remember even after all these years, there is only one Oxford and one MIT. Neither has the intake increased. Truth is the govt. bureaucrats cannot wield their power to get their "candidates" into an IIT. This is what is bothering them. Keep a 5% reservation for MHRD and all this crowing will stop. -- an IITian B.Tech and currently IIT faculty member. [5 May, 2005 1727hrs IST] there you go...now they do not want to spare IIT also..IIT questions may be very difficult to solve

for Mr. Dubey but not for the students who clears IIT-JEE....and please at least spare education system from Politics else you will ruin the system [5 May, 2005 0710hrs IST] Hey , Lets get the things straight. IIT is institution of merit no doubt about it . The exams are

tough too no doubt about it . But then these exams were never for people who simply dont have the guts to study hard. It was only for who could push them a little harder to achieve what they wanted ever . Make syllabus easy what it is going to achieve . An equation such as F = ma where F is the force and m is mass and a is the acceleration can become a difficult when you add the element of friction and then it becomes F = uMA where u is the coefficient of friction. You take

friction between two surfaces and it becomes F = (u-u0) ma. So where do you draw the line . Everyone knows F =ma but the complication arise when we add the real life forces to the equations. These are the real questions that engineers have to answer in real life . So you got to be extra good if you want to design better things ( even though most of IITians work for software trust me good software too is not easy to build ). So if we allow mediocrity to come in course we are actually eliminating good people in early stages. If you are not trained to work hard early on you will never work hard ( in the right sense) or you might have to work harder later on becoz you did not do it when time was right. Studying IIT for me was opening my brains to such an extent that I could never imagine. PET was pretty easy compared to that. But the syllabus brought the strength and stamina in me. Hopefully the course content may never go down and mediocrity may never succeed [4 May, 2005 1753hrs IST] The government should stop messing with educational institutes.

[4 May, 2005 1741hrs IST] Yet another example of how shallow and bureaucratic thinking (if at all there is a thought behind

it) corrupts all that is left of meritocracy in our educational systems. How on earth does a 'simpler' exam solve the problems of stress on the candidates!!?? It defies logic and common sense. It will only raise cut offs and reduce the difference between the first and the last. For so many years, the tough competition has been one of the bases on which the IITs have held their prestige. For so many years, meritorious and capable students have managed to handle the pressures of both the board exams and the JEE. Those who are suggesting simplification of the exams it seems are now doubting if the students of current times are as capable of handling such pressures as those of previous years! With due respect to the CBSE and the examinations held by it, there is at least a little more required to clear the JEE than to get a good score in the CBSE Board Examinations. If the logic of simplification were to be extended, then what stops one from concluding that entrance to the IITs should also be based on the CBSE Board exam scores. And if at all that happens, god help Brand IIT! [4 May, 2005 1455hrs IST] Yes, It's really tough. It's been 7 years so far i cleared IIT JEE, but i still remember the tough two

year preparation i went through. It's a challenge to maintain standard while making test simpler. And i think we should make it simpler. I don't want guys to study day and night for two years, that changes psychology, body processes get affected and that for life and causes depression to many who don't clear. They waste two years. I agree that tough test leads to better candidates but there should be a way around to get same quality (interview etc) while test is simpler. That's a challenge and let's take that challenge. [4 May, 2005 1359hrs IST

COMMENTS ON GIVING SEATS TO BOARDS TOPPERS

Rishi Kumar IITKGP, Baroda, says: Mr. Editor, I think u tried atleast 7 times to get into an IIT and did not make it so you are trying to make various illogical ways of getting in (for your son maybe). I do not blame you for being desperate, I just think you need to have sense and know what u are writing. I am sure if you can write an article in the true spirit of what was said things would seem very different. Shame on your common and journalistic sense!!! [1 Aug, 2008 1420hrs IST]

Raju, Chennai, says: Raw Intelligence!! Top 1% students in all board exams you will have only one gender in IIT. Most board exams are only testing ability to photocopying the answer as it is in the text book. Make a unique set of questions each time for JEE. [1 Aug, 2008 1043hrs IST]

Sushant Shekhar, NIT Tiruchirapally, says: What the hell!Top 1% from boards???Hello..everybody knows that boards are not meant to test your analytical skills...they have always been testing how well you mug..they won't test how well you can handle a 'real' problem..in which you are required to apply your mind..IIT-JEE has always been succesfull in selecting the cream...students who may not be good at "by-hearting" things but are excellent analyzers.And most importantly..they are masters of what you call "The Basics".A student who sucks at basic fundas may excel in the boards.I have seen many students who didn't perform very well at the boards but were superb when it came to those abilities I have talked about.Similarly I have come across a no. of students who topped the boards..but were not very good at basics!They topped just because they mugged well!The difference is applicable to AIEEE as well.This isn't expected from such high level authorities like people from inside IIT.I thought they were intelligent enough to take correct decisions! [1 Aug, 2008 0952hrs IST]

Sundaram Vanka, United States, says: Why should 'communication skills' be included as part of JEE? The idea is to have the JEE select future engineers, not bloggers or journalists. In any case, whatever communication skills an engineer needs - like technical report writing, seminars - are already part of engineering curriculum. It's surprising Professor Idichandy misses this point. Coming to why there aren't enough girl students in IIT, the notion that parents don't send their daughters to coaching centers plain wrong. How else can one explain the large number of girl students attending coaching classes for state level entrance exams? At the cost of being politically incorrect - and not having this comment published - the simple answer is reservations. [1 Aug, 2008 0946hrs IST]

vivek gupta, US, says: IIT's should make radical changes in their exam patterns so that one who is mentally smart can make it to IIT's. IIT's have their own standard which should be maintained. [1 Aug, 2008 0941hrs IST] ajit paldhe, Surat, says: What M.S.Ananth is asking for is like asking for perpetual machine.It is ideal and will remain dream forever. Classes are here to stay.If students get in to IIT by recognizing question pattern,then it reflects poorly on question paper setters. On more practical side, there is no reason to belittle achievements of those who get into IIT,with or without classes. They understand concepts certainly better than board students. Put at least 2 yrs of dedicated preparation and more importantly hold theit nerves in 6 hrs of exam. Giving weightage to Board exam is full of pitholes. Communication skills are important but IIT should help IITans to improve skills but should not be part of exam as in CAT. Previous system of screening followed by subjective paper on the line of IAS seems to be best to test students apprach to problem solving. [31 Jul, 2008 2136hrs IST] Sharad Gupta, singapore, says: Every IITian has some quality in it.Thats why they are studying in such TOP college. There is no Question to blame them. Cheers IITians... [31 Jul, 2008 2052hrs IST] Raj, N J, says: Nonsense. What Brand IIT needs is – 1. Better post graduate/research importance. 2. Regarding selection, basically stick to testing basic fundas - coaching or not, they are required for an engineering field. I don't see why anyone who has mastered the basics not enter the IITs. And yes, you cannot leave the testing of basic fundas to the board exams - utterly stupid - looks like some other ulterior motive behind such proposals. Do you want to kill a supposedly good thing going. You don't do ath much good compared to JEE in the 4 years, the least you have to concentrate on is improving the post graduate / research to international standards. [31 Jul, 2008 2045hrs IST] amit, IIT-kgp, says: I am in IIT-KGP now. And i have observed declination in the JEE qualified students.This is simply because of two reasons (1)The standard of JEE has fallen significantly in last 3-4 years. (2)The intake has been increased dramatically from 3500 to 5500.(it will increase further because of OBC reservation and establishment of new IITs.) IITs are no more getting brilliant students as they should get. I totally disagree with what prof. M S Ananth said about the cutoff percentage in board exam.I never scored more than 80% in my school days,but i still in IIT. [31 Jul, 2008 2037hrs IST]

Anon, NC, says: No harm in keeping the JEE, making it like SAT in the US but adding other elements like recommendations, verifiable extra curricular, public service, leadership qualities, research capabilities, etc. like they do in the US. The JEE will determine some level of intelligence and others elements will determine how well-rounded a student is. The challenge will be in the "verifiable" qualifier ;) [31 Jul, 2008 1929hrs IST] manu, delhi, says: its absurd and presumptuous [31 Jul, 2008 1909hrs IST] K.Vijayakumar, Ashburn VA, USA, says: Probably IIT professors want geniuses as students so that the required teaching efforts by them will be minimal and they will have more time for lucrative consultancy work!! Hope they will not interfere with a time-tested and near- perfect entrance test like the JEE in their selfish interests. [31 Jul, 2008 1849hrs IST] Shekhar, Mumbai, says: I am in IITB. I can proudly say, that never did I get an aggregate above 95% in my entire school/college career.Never did I come in the top, even 3 % of Board exams.....! All the consistent top rankers, in my school/college..batch mates...sorry to say, not one cleared the JEE.....! So, do I lack 'raw intelligence' or they ? [31 Jul, 2008 1701hrs IST] Black Hat, Somewhere, says: OK, the intake is mediocre. What about your processing (teaching) process, Mr. Dean? [31 Jul, 2008 1501hrs IST] arjun , bihar, says: I think they don’t know that maximum students give boards or their school exam after doing some sort of coaching ,which is none the less tilted more towards mugging rather than understanding the concept. So even they do these it would close the doors for millions of students who have somewhat average academic history but are high on intellect. [31 Jul, 2008 1136hrs IST] Abhishek Agarwal, gurgaon, says: Any exam is prone to coaching be it gre gmat or sat or whatever. There is nothing like raw intelligence and the need for one. [31 Jul, 2008 1129hrs IST]

debasish, Pune, says: This is ridiculous. How can you tell that people who are appearing in school exam is not taking coaching? You cannot judge a person by school mark. That anyone can mug it up. I am very surprised that these ideas are coming from people in IIT. I don't know what is the best idea of getting raw brains which is a nice idea. There should be a proper thought process behind this idea. [31 Jul, 2008 1106hrs IST] J.E.Swamidoss, chennai, says: JEE is one of the correct method of selecting the right talent for the most sought after technical colleges. The board examinations are only testing the memory power of the students. JEE should be there. The students who are attending the coaching classes are given exercises and they are asked to apply those concepts while they are studying. By this way, they will understand it properly and apply when they pursue higher studies. Moreover, it is not correct that many parents are not sending their daughters to coaching classes. This was a situation a decade back and not now. As a part of selection, identifying the right soft skills of students can be extended as a part of selection into IITs . [31 Jul, 2008 1100hrs IST] Nitesh, Atlanta, says: The whole idea of including board cut-offs of the level of 85% and things like that are completely ridiculous and making such statements is much more so.If you are really concerned about the active part coaching takes place in shaping up the student's performance,you can always bring innovation in your exam format,include elements of surprise to judge the best minds.Rather than complaining about the coaching classes,why don't the IIT dons see the constant degradation in the quality of questions being asked in JEE,which many a mediocre students can easily solve now..surely these questions were not put in JEE paper by the coaching classes they blame for everything. [31 Jul, 2008 1110hrs IST] Deepak, Texas, says: As usual, a lot of people are bashing IITs and IITians. Being an IITian myself,, I have realized that IITians are criticized for being arrogant and bossy way more than appropriate. I have seen so many people who didn't go to IITs and have a tremendous grudge against those who did. This is ridiculous. The reason why IITians start to group together is because the others don't want to see themselves with IITians. So much for exclusivity. Coming to the point, JEE should be re-modeled to help ensure that coaching institutes minimally affect who gets in and who does not. [31 Jul, 2008 1025hrs IST]

Pradeep Beniwal, Sirsa, says: I completely disagree with, prof. saying for getting into an IIT a student must have good communication skills along with being expertise in physics,chemistry and maths.Communication skills show your exposure to language.Doing this students only from elite schools will get into IITs.A student from a state board of school may not have that much of exposure to language but he may have basic talent,basic engineering skills of that we are talking of.If we put communication skills a criteria for entrance to JEE ,we will surely miss the basic talent.People with better communication skills often tend to lack basic engineering skills and try to find a scapegoat to blame all their shortcomings. [31 Jul, 2008 1005hrs IST] ramnik, mumbai, says: No standards are maintained in recruitments. HRD Ministry knows about it but no action against the corruption directors. Remove the corruption first. Please raise your voice against the corruption prevailing in IITs and against the corrupt officials. [31 Jul, 2008 1000hrs IST] ajit_g8, India, says: It is well known that IIT dons are not very good at running the IITs. Fees across the board have skyrocketed but the services (mainly accommodation and recreational facilities) have plummeted. Conditions of the most of campuses are not anything to be proud of. Tendency of making knee jerk reactions is common. In this context, it is hardly surprising that there are problems with JEE. There is no point in blaming the coaching centers, which operate legally. JEE is conducted by a handful of teachers which is a problem. It is no easy task for a handful of people to examine lakhs of students. Greater participation of IIT teachers and more human evaluation is required. JEE used to pick up the best of students when the answers were evaluated by people. Computerised evaluation only looks at the final result not at the mechanism used to obtain it. That is the main problem with JEE. Tying up JEE with performance in board exams will only rob the students of the opportunity to get into the IITs. [31 Jul, 2008 0954hrs IST] Ram Kumar, Seattle, says: Already the students are stressed these days, and in most of the states anybody who passes class 12 exams can get into engineering. JEE should be the sole criteria for admission , it is too much stressful to concentrate both on plus 2 and JEE, a student who is able to get 60% marks in their exams has sufficient knowledge of the subjects. There are numerous engineering colleges and you can admission into most of them simply if you pass the plus 2 exams, in this context who will take the extra pains to perform well both in Plus 2 and JEE. Also Dean(Students) has told to do away with JEE because it affects girls admission, this contradicts the other professors assertion that people get into JEE because of coaching centres and not because of natural talent. talented girls can get admission through JEE based on their talents, why should we blame no coaching opportunities here. I feel their recommendations are based on false assumptions. [31 Jul, 2008 0912hrs IST]

Roopa, Chennai, says: Board exams also encourage learning by rote. It tests just memory power, not thinking power. So it is better to maintain the current system. [31 Jul, 2008 0909hrs IST] Asif, Delhi, says: Don't forget that students also get coaching and tutors for class XII exams. At that stage too, it will be difficult to determine which students have "raw" intelligence and which students are learning by rote. Remember that class XII exams are designed to help students pass. The board exams and IIT-JEE are two different tests with different purposes.Excelling in XII does not imply that student is the cream of the crop of students and the next IITian. [31 Jul, 2008 0848hrs IST] Puneet Shivam, Chicago, says: I disagree with Gaurav Wankhede comment. If the person who he thinks has better communication skills is given a chance to study in IIT will not be able to survive the IIT engineering onslaught. The pace of education, complexity of assignments, quizzes will break his back I can guarantee it. Some of the people who clear JEE also find it difficult to survive the challenge of studying 4 years in IIT. Whether consultancy or research there is problem solving skills required in day to day work. On an average an IITian stands a better chance of doing any engineering job well as an engineer than the other engineer. In a organization similar to McDonald, US organization where there is less innovation yes it is true intelligence does not matter and it seems his consultancy organization is similar. In an engineering organization engineers are assets and will always be so. People with better interpersonal skills tend to ignore basic engineering skills and falter in making engineering decisions in my experience of more than decade working with several leaders/managers who have been non-IIT'ians. Then misusing their interpersonal skills they find a scapegoat and somebody to blame. Yes, they succeed more in material life but in reality they are failures who can not even make right decisions of their own or go with the right engineering approach! [31 Jul, 2008 0752hrs IST] IIT graduate, New York, says: With an IIT in every city, and 50% reservation, and 85% cutoff in Class XII exams, and extra credit for extra-circular activities, we are approaching the time when there will be more prestige and recognition in studying at a select few IIT coaching classes than the IITs themselves. [31 Jul, 2008 0636hrs IST]

Deepak, Singapore, says: It means the director thinks that who get more numbers in school are only brilliant, then he should first think about Indian schooling system, where you get more marks if you are a book worm , it does not show intelligence and even for schools students take so many coachings so how he will stop them. [31 Jul, 2008 0632hrs IST] Vinay Syal, Canada, says: Rubbish ! as long as the students do well in for year year programme , then where is the problem? It is good that the JEE candidates are trained at the mental & commitment level required for being an excellent engineer. Don't we train the candidates whether it is NDA , MBA , IAS ? You can't crack JEE with the natural talent in you ? If by fluke one has got in to IIT , then one will be eliminated during his four year programme if one does not perform well. I think this is a non issue at this juncture. IIT has been producing world class engineers for years together and off late it has become a fashion to incorporate changes and ultimately these people will bring IIT's reputation down to earth. [31 Jul, 2008 0532hrs IST] gajanan, Mumbai , says: The IIT JEE is good, but why Prof Anant and others are lamenting is because of the following reasons 1) The pre IT age saw IITians almost a high percent go to academics and many into research, This has dropped drastically. 2) The Silicon Valley success has spurred many IITians to be entrepreneurs. I have personally spoken to many bright IITians in USA ( on my visits). They want to become a Khosla , a Narayanamurthy or Premji. 3) This new phenomenon among IITians is welcome as it creates wealth and generates employment for the lesser fortunate who did not go to IIT. 4) Somebody has written about Feynman and others. Long before Feynman , Kolkata produced in 1930-1931, Satyen Bose ( whose work won the Nobel prize to fellows who confirmed it experimentally, recently). CV Raman , Saha , JC Bose ( who predated Marconi in his work) and a great band of physicists then . Kolkata was next to Gottingen in Physics. The spirit and raw intelligence was in full cry in 1931. Raman was the first Asian to win a Nobel Prize in Physics. Now there is Prof Mazumdar of ISI Kolkata who is doing great work in race genetics , and collaborating all over the worlo I do not know whether he is from IIT. His work is very very seminal. The spirit of 1931. Kolkata to go beyond frontiers is lacking now. 5) Prof Anant is feeling the pinch because IITians are not taking up to research and academics in a big way as they did in the start of 70's and 80's, when the Karmarkar's were produced. There is trend of producing entrepreneurial managers. IIT's should do a survey as to how many have gone to research and academics now and how many did in the 70's and 80's . This itsself will do a good study as to how the spirit of enterprise ,wealth creation for social causes has been diverted from the the spirit to go beyond frontiers in science. [31 Jul, 2008 0517hrs IST]

Anurag, Los Angeles, says: One thing I agree with the the Dean is that students today actually do not worry about their Class XII board exams as these board exams have no importance in getting into IIT. We need to make the students understand the importance of completing the schooling phase somehow. How it should be done is something these bigwigs should come out with. [31 Jul, 2008 0400hrs IST] Puneet Shivam, Chicago, says: The JEE paper is not even possible to crack for graduated engineers of other colleges. So, it is impossible for an IIT'ian like me to believe that it does not allow raw intelligence to take in. As a matter of fact it is very difficult to define raw interlligence. IIT is an engineering school and not a management school. To study engineering you need Physics, Maths and Chemistry and less of communication skills. There can be coaching for communication skills as well just like people do it for IIMs and other management colleges. I believe deans opinion is biased with personal factors. [31 Jul, 2008 0342hrs IST] deepak kumar, USA, says: I have been fortunate enough to prepare and clear the JEE during 1990.At that time,the JEE questions were so difficult that unless you have understood the concepts ,you can't understand the questions let alone solving them.A coaching by teacher helps in understanding the concepts when one has difficulty with.But one could not understand the huge number of concepts and master them with the help of teacher.I cleared the test based on my self study and interest in the subjects and the interest in getting admitted to IIT.I don't think that at least at that time JEE was not attracting the very good student.The problem in India is not about the talents and the education one gets in the IIT,but it is about the opportunity for research in academics and in the industry and also the money one makes in India industry as an engineer.That discourages the IITians to stay back in India and contribute to the growth of India.This can be solved only by increasing the opportunity in india by agressive liberalization and bringing competition in all sectors of the economy and supporting the Indian company to increase their scale and become global.IIT directors should focus their attention on helping in establishing the new IITs and staffing with the best teachers.Also,in attracting the best students for MTECH and PHD programme.Otherwise the IIT brand will be diluted. [31 Jul, 2008 0302hrs IST]

Shankar, N, says: It would be a HUGE blunder to change JEE format the way Ananth wants it. The whole reason JEE is so successful is because no emphasis is placed on performance in school. If school performance evaluations were so good, why are 12th standard "toppers" bloopers when it comes to IIT? Physics, Chemistry and Mathematics are most effective in testing pure reasoning skills and is the BEST way to evaluate a student's intrinsic reasoning skills. Coaching classes can only do so much to artificially improve a student's JEE performance. IIT JEE entrance tests can be made even more tough to eliminate "practiced" performers. Let me tell you this. My classmate in school, Arvind Sankar scored the 5th rank in IIT JEE in 1994 and took no coaching classes. He scored 94% in 12th standard, which is not very high -- if his performance in school were examined, it would probably be a little over average. But the guy was a prodigy. He learnt calculus on his own by 5th standard, understood UNIX and Assembly by 6th standard, had read the 3 volumes of "Feynmans lectures on Physics" by 7th standard. He went on to win a Silver medal for India in the International Mathematics Olympiad and a Gold Medal in Physics in Hong Kong. He has now completed his Masters and Phd in Mathematics from the most prestigious MIT in USA. If admissions were done based on Mr. Ananth's lame format with school scores, such genius would have simply died. If at all we change anything, we should keep the format the same and make the examinations even more tougher to "trick" the coaching classes. The plus side of India's huge population is that we also have some extraordinary talent in our country. Think Ramanujan -- arguably the greatest genius our country has ever produced. His mock theta functions confound scientists and researchers even today. His performance in school was most dismal and yet his genius can't be explained even today. IIT is the only shining beacon of the best Indian talent -- please don't spoil it by mixing it with substandard 12th standard evaluations. [31 Jul, 2008 0241hrs IST] Jithin, NC, USA, says: Keeping the pass percentage of 85% will not solve the issue. It would only worsen the problem. Scoring 85% in school is not a big deal in many education boards. For eg: in Tamil nadu board where i studied. A student who can has mere knowledge of prescribed textbooks(without understanding the basic logic) will be able to score more than 90% easily. This would mean more incompetant people appearing for JEE. [31 Jul, 2008 0233hrs IST] Anurag, USA, says: This is so ridiculous. One person is saying looking for raw talent ( i agree to him) and another one says less girls are clearing JEE and direct admission. Where does this question of girl and boys come into picture. It is only talent. I myself having cleared JEE in 1998 feel that they shld follow the old pattern of screening test and then the subjective test of a higher and tougher level beyond 12th std. [31 Jul, 2008 0227hrs IST]

RAnant, USA, says: The current JEE system works. That's why IITs have a brand image that no other university in the world could compete against. [31 Jul, 2008 0206hrs IST] Abhishek Anan, USA, says: Do you know Mr. Ananth that numerous coaching institutions are in place to prepare students for board examinations of various states (more so for CBSE and ICSE). So your idea of acquiring students with "raw intelligence" is nothing but another of those beaurocratic upheavals that lacks steam. There is no guarantee that the so called 0.1% students are the best minds. If you ask me, they are not. For once at least, think out of the box and dont look for intelligence in marksheets. None of the great scientists or philosophers were from that 0.1% lot. [31 Jul, 2008 0201hrs IST] Kumar, Baltimore, MD, says: I laugh at IIT Chennai dean's comments. Because it is ridiculous. Here are my reasons 1. Does he not understand that getting good scores in respective education boards are also done by using Coaching classes. So if the hypothesis is you will select the cream from the cream, probably that assumption needs to be verified first. 2. What is 'raw' intelligence? Can a person with less intelligence be able to have his mind moulded to be able to answer questions intended for high IQ people. I don't think so. Maybe the standard of questions are failing. 3. IIT are technical institutes. They don't need people with good communication skills, they need people with good mental skills. And to hold IITs accountable, they need show cutting edge research done and patents obtained for all the 'raw' intelligence they have got before. 4. So coaching classes are stopping girls for getting admits to IIT because parents don't send girls to those institutes. Well, that is something to be taken up with the parents. 5. Do you see mediocrity in IIT due to the students or due to the teaching? Why is the teaching in IIT never discussed? The education system is not uniform across the country. Neither there is evidence of only good students getting higher percentages in their respective boards. What you basically are proposing is further use the cream from the boards to get the best. Basically, you want to cut down your work thats all that I see to this. [31 Jul, 2008 0139hrs IST] Ady, SFO, says: This is the biggest load of crap I've come across in a long time. Me and a lot of my batchmates had cracked the JEE without going to a coaching institutes. I am based in the silicon valley now and most of the brightest here are from IITs. So lets reserve the whining for the babies. And as far as CBSE is concerned, frankly, it sucks big time. CBSE toppers (and probably other board toppers) and pretty darn dumb. Hard-working yes, but intelligent: not too much [31 Jul, 2008 0131hrs IST]

vij, usa, says: IIT has top 100 rankers who score mere 65-70% score in CBSE and local board schools. Simply because they sit back at home for a year after 12th, they do well in JEE and get into. I was one of top scorer in board and didn't do well in JEE because of pattern unfamiliar with me. I didn't want to waste my one year in prestigious local engineering college. [31 Jul, 2008 0128hrs IST] Vinayak Dasgupta, New Delhi, says: This is ridiculous. If one sees how the students train for the IITs, one would realize that the current JEE format selects nothing but the most intelligent and the most hardworking students. Having passed 12th recently and seen my friends prepare, I think that the admission to the IITs on the basis of boards marks is regressive. A students performance in school is affected by a lot of factors but these factors are easier to overcome or to tackle for two years, which is the time that is required to prepare for the JEE. It should also be mentioned that the topics covered in JEE make the students prepared for the curriculum that lies ahead - this is something that the boards syllabus can never achieve. IITs is a university for engineering where, obviously, maths, physics and chemistry are the make or break subjects. Hence, why should a student who, say, has bad marks in arts or humanities be denied admission to the IITs just because those bad marks brings down his percentage in boards. I think a trial itself will prove it. It is inevitable that the cutoffs for the JEE will fall even lower if only the top 1% of the board toppers are allowed to sit. [31 Jul, 2008 0125hrs IST] thn, Newyork, says: A person is conditioned by it's growth, parenting and education. You need to go down below and improve those so that you can have "raw intelligence" in all of the people who are participating in exam. Then you choose who is best conditioned or can receive best conditioning in IIT or better create conditions where you can create some raw intelligence. All were almost same with out conditioning. IIT Alumini [31 Jul, 2008 0123hrs IST] Danny, bangalore, says: IIT M is making an excuse for not being able to set a question paper that would test for the kind of the so called raw intelligence. I am shocked that prof Ananth, who I have a great deal of regard, is restoring to this cheap publicity. what do you mean by saying only the top 1% in a school board exam should participate? so someone who say is between the top 1 and 2% gets eliminated, what about his raw intelligence. given that there is so much of variance in the way one scores in the board exams, prof Ananth's comment that the such board exams are "valid" to differentiate between the raw and the ripe intelligence is shocking. Instead he should look at the way a Harvard or an MIT administer their admissions, wholesome individuals get selected over one trick ponies!! take that Ananth [31 Jul, 2008 0111hrs IST]

T, Pitt, says: So what? They work hard to crack it. Its only but fair! [31 Jul, 2008 0038hrs IST] re: Is JEE the best way to pick students for IITs?

sir, jee .....definitely not a better way to choose good student....at 1st in two year restriction case ,the student from remote village are not able to get into iit's .In 90's or till 2005 they are able to get into iit's.As we know India lies in villages .....then why this institute " institute of national importance " curb the rural student to get into it. yours faithfully rajnish ranjan nit- jaipur. Posted by rajnish ranjan @ 8/2/2008 11:59 PM re: Is JEE the best way to pick students for IITs?

if it is this way.....firstly either level down the questions of jee to which our school teachers can answer us. or else ask all the schools to hire the best teachers so that they can make a student atleast ready to face the tougher questions of jee. i dont knw why u people are against the coaching institutes?? student only goes to them when his school teacher fails to answer even the easiest question of iit jee.. for selection criteria i think possible solution is to make cut off percentages higher like 80%abv..... then also what will happen to the dreams of droppers?can any1 answer?? Posted by student 11th @ 8/2/2008 12:52 PM re: Is JEE the best way to pick students for IITs?

Looking back after 5 years, since I passed out from IIT, I feel now these days good intellect/talent is not coming out from IIT these days. Many of them are just another cramers and simply do in their jobs what is being asked for without trying to fill in the gaps without applying their true brain. Asked a couple of them regarding the JEE pattern and they say "Just religiously cram for 2 years and you'll get in". Now, we are forced to believe that there is something wrong with the exam pattern somewhere. Try carefully looking at few papers of past couple of years and you'll be zapped to find that each year questions follow more or less same pattern. More objective type paper which obviously is not at all difficult to check but at the same time it limits the people, who are trying to select, to have a look into the exam takers of what they really think about the problem and how they try to solve it.

I'm sure different guys have different ways, now we are talking about creativity/intellect. We all know how difficult JEE exam used to be in 90s (example: there was a paper with only 5 or 6 questions!!). If you can apply the intellect you'll crack it else be in peace. Compare this with these days and you'll find the difference. One can not trust the educational systems in India, different boards have different ways. Say for example ICSE borad does not test real intelligence what they like to test is how much a student can cram and fill in sheets after sheets during board exam. CBSE, ICSE, State boards have different syllabuses which have only 60% relevance for JEE. Simultaneously preparing for exams like JEE and score good in 12th is something like killing two birds in a shot which is not impossible but difficult to achieve for many and that's why many deserving candidates can not take JEE exam as they couldn't score good on their board exam. Take examples in your city/town and you'll see for yourself that a certain student might have scored 90 % + but couldn't qualify JEE exam !! Hmmmmm... After second thought I realize that why I'm writing to tell what is bad with the pattern, rather I should jot down the points which can help the system to deteriorate things further - 1. Increase the number of objective type questions. This will help in speed and NOT accuracy. 2. Increase the number of IITs and govt. should not take rest until and unless they do this in every state. 3. Increase the capacity in each IIT so that after passing out an IITian can say that I belong to top 50% cream. (1% looks so odd :( ) 4. Increase the number of reservations on basis of caste/creed/sect/gentry so that no one is left behind. We can call it "Type" of candidate, on form. 5. JEE exam can be scrapped, instead top rankers from schools can be provided admissions directly. .......... and the list still goes on, Please fill in the rest..... Posted by Adish Shukla @ 8/1/2008 2:08 PM re: Is JEE the best way to pick students for IITs?

I am a third year B.Tech student at IIT Kharagpur. I agree with the newspaper article that JEE is not the best way to select students for IITs. But, I do not fully agree with the other aspects mentioned in the article. First of all, I strongly disagree with the point where it has been suggested that the top 1% of students from different boards should be able to give JEE. Throughout the article, the writer is talking about "raw intelligence" but he is completely wrong in thinking that the various boards results categorize the students according to raw intelligence, rather it is the opposite. I would cite a very good example to this. Many of the students who get more than 90% marks in CBSE 10th boards are not able to score even 75% in CBSE 12th boards. This is not because 12th boards are difficult, but it is because the students prepare for competitive exams and do not devote their time to cram for 12th boards as they did for 10th boards. With respect to this point, I would say that JEE is a much better option to get students with raw intelligence than the corresponding board exams. JEE is a very conceptual exam, but the over indulgence of coaching institutes during JEE preparation does result in SOME less-than-best students coming in. But, the writer has not given any statistical evidence to why he thinks that there are MANY such students. Now, coming back to my earlier point that JEE is not the best way to select students for IITs, I have

a completely different reason to justify my statement. For IITs, the admission process goes like this- First of all, students give JEE, then they get their ranks and after that, during the counselling process, they choose their branches. In this process, it so happens that most of the students know nothing about the branch they are getting in. The branch choices are based solely on the following reasons: 1. The last year patterns indicate the branches corresponding to their rank. 2. The other close-rank students are taking that branch. 3. There are no other options remaining to choose from. Following this process, a student after getting into the branch realizes that he has no interest in his respective branch which leads to poor results during his graduate studies. If the IIT admission procedure has to be made more efficient, the students' choices of interest have to be considered and the branch allocation should not be based solely on JEE rank. One way out is that those students who pass the JEE exam should be given a small aptitude test corresponding to the choices that he makes irrespective of his JEE rank, so that his branch of interest can be chosen and then the branch should be allotted. This way, not only will the students get better results in IITs but will be more interested in going for higher education and research, an aspect which is drastically lacking in the IITs and which the professors regularly complain about. Posted by Abhineet Gupta @ 8/1/2008 11:41 AM re: Is JEE the best way to pick students for IITs?

According to me, JEE is the best to get into IIT, if the director of IIT madras says the successful candidate mind is prepared by coaching class tutors then there is flaw of the exam setter not that of tutors or student. I am deadly against the the dean of IIT madras statement that there should be direct admission because nobody can judge the student on the basis of marks because our present education system doesn't focus on the actual intelligence of student and doesn't focus on overall personality. I am also against the statement that only 1% of students from state boards and CBSE should be permitted to appear for the JEE because a number of students every year got selected in IIT in spite of that they are only mediocre student. Posted by himanshu @ 7/31/2008 10:53 PM

re: Is JEE the best way to pick students for IITs? --- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sub- Waste of talent and govt. money by the IITs Sir , I am writing you in reference to your article in TOI today i.e. on 31.07.08 , in all the competitive exams, the number of selected candidates is more than the available seats. This is being done to make all the seats filled up against those who don’t turn-up either to seek better opportunities or in search of better institutes and that is why a student appears in not only one competitive exam but in number of competitive exams available at that particular stage. Same happens for engineering competitive exams and students take part in IIT JEE, AIEEE as well as his/her own state’s entrance exams. After getting declared successful in these, they are invited for the selection of college as well as the branch of engineering. In this counseling process, the higher rankers get their choices easily and straight away take admissions but as ranks go down in the merit, either the candidates don’t turn up or they compromise with either the institute or the trade of engineering. In the second category, candidates go on trying their chances in other competitions with better ranks and better options. And of course, once a better option of institute and branch is available, they leave the already allotted seat in some earlier competitions and join the best suited to them. To fill such gaps, AIEEE has a system of second round of counseling and allot these vacant seats against the DROPOUTS for those students who are listed in merit list but couldn’t get through due to lower merit. To my utmost surprise, the premier institutions like the IITs have no such provision for second counseling and they don’t fill the dropout seats and allow to continue with vacant seats against dropouts. However, students who were declared successful in entrance exam and attended counseling are betrayed due to tendency of keeping more than one options open by candidates who are ranked higher. If institutions like IITs are keeping the seats vacant against the DROPOUTS, is a waste of available talent and govt. money and at the same time causing frustration among those who wish to pursue studies in premier institutions of Inia i.e. IITs inspite of being talented and declared successful in entrance exam. An entrance exam where success rate is only approx. 2% and coaching institutes run an industry of approx 10 thousand crores every year. Through this letter I appeal to union minister HRD to kindly look into the matter so that successful and deserved candidates are given their chance. I would like to invite your attention towards news item in The Economic Times dated 25-07-2008 which tells that in IIT Gandhinagar, only 103 students have joined out of a total of 120 seats available. That means in Gandhinagar only 17 students from the available successfull declared candidates can be given chance which at the moment IITs are not giving. The same may be the situation of vacancies in other IITs also about which you as a national newspaper can get an instant information. The present system of entrance exam is satisfactory because like any other competetive exam students prepare either by self or through coaching institutes.I feel there is a need to clarify what

the directors mean by raw intellegentia. Do the directors observe that those selected through JEE are not intelliget? are not up to the mark? or do they have any data that non suitable candidates are getting through the JEE. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by Anshul Agarwala @ 7/31/2008 9:06 PM re: Is JEE the best way to pick students for IITs?

Somebody is on an agenda to destroy the best institutes of excellence in modern India. You donot need to demolish a Nalanda today, just destroy the culture of merit and IIT will become another ITI. The big question why is there such a concentrated attack to destroy the academic culture of merit in IIT's. Reservations based on caste, now faculty based on caste, adding new institutes from rented premises, now scrapping of JEE...all this is sinister to say the least. If the hon. Dean of IITM feels girl students are not comming in then why does he not propose a QUOTA FOR GIRLS? Just like AIIMS. Is it because it'll see the same fate as the women reservation bill pending in the parliament? Forget engineering for a moment are women in India not the most deprived and deserving of reservation before any OBC , SDC or ST. Where are the MEN in this land which is thanx to the greedy politicians the 'biggest hypocrisy in the world'? Shame on you who are taking shelter behind 'girls' and advocating scrapping the toughest test of merit that need to become even more tough and attract the best of the best ala ShitiKAnth thru the JEE. Coaching cannot be bad as it does raise the standard of the students post +2. In short no namby pamby ideas should be entertained by our self-serving administrators and politicians. Don't dilute milk with water.IIT is about 'doodh -ka-doodh, paani-ka-paani', so what, if it is funded by UGC. Posted by Amit @ 7/31/2008 8:42 PM re: Is JEE the best way to pick students for IITs?

Definitely, JEE is the best way to select students fr IITs. I totally disagree wid the statement made by Mr Ananth that 1% of topper students of differnt state boards should only permitted to appear in JEE. This will not be acceptable at any cost.... Posted by Durgesh Kumar Dwivedi @ 7/31/2008 12:28 PM