americas race obsession

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America's race obsession

The sudden appearance of nooses in the US is just the most blatant representation of the hostility many whites still

have for blacks.

Lionel McPherson

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October 30, 2007 6:00 PM |Printable version

In its American heyday, which ended around 1930, nooses inspired grave fear. The noose meant lynching, and not

the "high tech" kind US supreme court justice Clarence Thomas continues in self-delusion to lament.

Lynching functioned as a"ritual of blood", the sociologist Orlando Patterson has argued, communally directed by

whites mainly against black men in response to the South's forced transition from a slave society. Billie Holiday

gave voice to this terror through the haunting songStrange Fruit: "Southern trees bear strange fruit. Blood on the

leaves and blood at the root. Black bodies swinging in the southern breeze. Strange fruit hanging from the poplar

trees." Those words are made concrete in lynching postcards that proudly display suspended corpses at the centre

of local spectacles. The noose was no idle threat and certainly no joke. So what to make of the recent outbreak of

noose incidents, the knotted ropes without the bodies?

Nooses were hung from a purported whites-only tree at a high schoolin Jena, Louisianaafter a black student asked

whether he could sit under the tree. The principal had replied that students could sit where they wanted.Predictably, the letter of the law did not serve black students well. The decisively white school board, the white

district attorney, and an all-white jury could not have been expected to treat bullying violence by white students

and retaliatory schoolyard violence by black students in an evenhanded manner. AtColumbia Universityin New

York, a noose was hung from the office door of an African-American professor, sparking a protest rally and swift

condemnation from the campus community. Her response to the noose: "It felt very personal and very degrading."
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The Jena and Columbia incidents are only the most publicized. Nooses have lately made appearances inMaryland,

Pittsburgh,North CarolinaandLong Island, in a police station locker room. The US justice department claims to be

investigating - the incidents might violate federal and state laws - though no arrests have been made anywhere.

This same justice department found no evidence of unfair prosecution of the six black teenagers in Jena originally

charged with attempted second-degree murder.

None of these nooses was brutally put to use. Lynchings - of James Byrd Jr in 1998 and Michael Donald in 1981 -

stand out in contemporary America because they are rare. Perhaps this helps explain why some observers

underestimate the significance of the noose today. Lawyer and social criticWendy Kaminerbelieves that "hanging

a noose is expressive conduct" and, "hateful or not," on a par with "swastikas and burning crosses." Kaminer

transforms the noose into a hobbyhorse, namely, opposition to hate crime statutes that she supposes leave "all of

us ... less free." Such first amendment righteousness lacks sympathy and imagination.

The noose, at least a functional one, is not simply among various symbols of hate when left incongruously and

deliberately in the presence of African-Americans. We are well aware the device was a common means for

committing terroristic, racially-motivated murders. Here's a scenario. Outside your home, at your workplace or in apublic space, you find what appears to be a gun hung next to a hateful scrawling directed at people of your kind.

Surely you could understand - even if you were broadly skeptical about hate crime statutes - that this act might

well be intimidating or threatening along the lines of assault, whether the target was you in particular or

unspecified members of your group.

No doubt, the noose also is a symbol. These incidents represent a deep, lingering antipathy that more than a few

Americans have for blacks. Nooses can replace the epithet "nigger" as an expression of racial contempt and

privilege. "Nigger" doesn't fly any longer. Its use by non-blacks mostly succeeds in conveying plain racism or

ignorance amid an officially multiracial public that rejects such use. By contrast, the noose often gets explained as

a prank - insensitive yet inconclusively indicative of a racist attitude or environment. The joke presumably works

like this: You can't lynch black folks these days, but you probably can get away with aggressively tweaking their

tender sensibilities. Not amused? Oh well - lighten up, or appreciate the burdens of living in a free society.

The current hostility toward African-Americans is more routinely evident in ongoing obsessions with affirmative

action, IQ, rap music's "thug" culture and OJ Simpson, along with the increasingly mainstream strategy of shouting

down black grievances by accusing blacks of playing the race card or indulging in victimology. We're now told that

other Americans don't care much about race and that radically disparate outcomes by race don't bear much

relation to racial injustice. Against this background, the noose fad is hardly shocking. The country will revert soon

enough to its less blatant anti-black sensibilities.

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All Comments (72)Most Recommended Comments (0)

Saeed

Comment No.896704

October 30 18:25

ZAF

Lionel I think you'll find that many people, who are concerned or disturbed by racism, remain inactive because to

do anything might impact on their comfort zone.

We looked at this with regard to the Holocaust and Apartheid

http://www.thoughtleader.co.za/traps/2007/10/13/apartheid-impact-patriotism-is-the-virtue-of-the-vicious/

Action takes courage and most people would rather pay lip service or act dumb than face the consequences of

standing up and being counted.

[Offensive? Unsuitable?Report this comment.]Recommend?

ComicalSpook

Comment No.896719

October 30 18:33

GBR

Amazes me how black people keep their composure given the crap they have to put up with - and let's face it,

white society has had long enough to put things right. If anything, seems to me the plight of black people has been

put out of mind and out of sight in a post 9-11 world.


halgeel84

Comment No.896720

October 30 18:34

CAN

--Lionel McPherson
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protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896704,%20was%20written%20by%20Saeed,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%206:25%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Lionel%20I%20think%20you%27ll%20find%20that%20many%20people,%20who%20are%20concerned%20or%20disturbed%20by%20racism,%20remain%20inactimailto:[email 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protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896704,%20was%20written%20by%20Saeed,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%206:25%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Lionel%20I%20think%20you%27ll%20find%20that%20many%20people,%20who%20are%20concerned%20or%20disturbed%20by%20racism,%20remain%20inactihttp://crregistervote%28%27896704%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896704%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896719#comment-896719http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896719#comment-896719http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896719#comment-896719http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896719#comment-896719http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896719#comment-896719mailto:[email 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4/41

Peace to you. I would like to point ou that`American whites, which I suppose you do mean the middle and upper

class Americans, hate the poor, no matter of the colour of their skin. Thus you do know American white middle-

upper classes hate socalled 'white trash' as much as they hate poor blacks. I am from Africa[Somalia]. Now we are

being recolonised by the America's corporate/military complex using Black Africans as their 'native' conduits. So,

we do really need a serious semoitic reading of what theses nooses may or may not say about America's race

relations.

I do would what you think about Condi' Race, Jendi Frazer and other dagerous native informents who are bring

death and destruction to my people- In Somalia before we can discuss the symbolic meaning what these nooses

may mean for black Americans

Best, helgeel 84


MrPikeBishop

Comment No.896742

October 30 18:49

GBR

Aw Cif you dissapoint me... surely a cracking headline was waiting here

No noose is good news... etc

I'll get my hood.


BarkingBird

Comment No.896778

October 30 19:08

USA

I think an important point about this issue that has been overlooked is the class angle. The disgusting incident at

Columbia U. was more deeply disturbing because Americans tend to believe that racism lingers only among the

white poor and working class and mainly in the rural South. But Columbia showed that racism remains rife

throughout all America, all income, all regions, and all class levels.

It highlights why affirmative action in some form remains necessary and why Americans need to work harder at

integration and historical understanding.

[Offensive? Unsuitable?Report this comment.]
mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896720,%20was%20written%20by%20halgeel84,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%206:34%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20--Lionel%20McPherson%20Peace%20to%20you.%20I%20would%20like%20to%20point%20ou%20that%60American%20whites,%20which%20I%20suppose%20yomailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896720,%20was%20written%20by%20halgeel84,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%206:34%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20--Lionel%20McPherson%20Peace%20to%20you.%20I%20would%20like%20to%20point%20ou%20that%60American%20whites,%20which%20I%20suppose%20yomailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896720,%20was%20written%20by%20halgeel84,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%206:34%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20--Lionel%20McPherson%20Peace%20to%20you.%20I%20would%20like%20to%20point%20ou%20that%60American%20whites,%20which%20I%20suppose%20yohttp://crregistervote%28%27896720%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896720%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896742#comment-896742http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896742#comment-896742http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896742#comment-896742http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896742#comment-896742http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896742#comment-896742mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896742,%20was%20written%20by%20MrPikeBishop,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%206:49%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Aw%20Cif%20you%20dissapoint%20me...%20surely%20a%20cracking%20headline%20was%20waiting%20hereNo%20noose%20is%20good%20news...%20etmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896742,%20was%20written%20by%20MrPikeBishop,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%206:49%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Aw%20Cif%20you%20dissapoint%20me...%20surely%20a%20cracking%20headline%20was%20waiting%20hereNo%20noose%20is%20good%20news...%20etmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896742,%20was%20written%20by%20MrPikeBishop,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%206:49%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Aw%20Cif%20you%20dissapoint%20me...%20surely%20a%20cracking%20headline%20was%20waiting%20hereNo%20noose%20is%20good%20news...%20ethttp://crregistervote%28%27896742%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896742%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896778#comment-896778http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896778#comment-896778http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896778#comment-896778http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896778#comment-896778http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896778#comment-896778mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896778,%20was%20written%20by%20BarkingBird,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:08%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20think%20an%20important%20point%20about%20this%20issue%20that%20has%20been%20overlooked%20is%20the%20class%20angle.%20The%20disgustmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896778,%20was%20written%20by%20BarkingBird,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:08%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20think%20an%20important%20point%20about%20this%20issue%20that%20has%20been%20overlooked%20is%20the%20class%20angle.%20The%20disgustmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896778,%20was%20written%20by%20BarkingBird,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:08%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20think%20an%20important%20point%20about%20this%20issue%20that%20has%20been%20overlooked%20is%20the%20class%20angle.%20The%20disgustmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896778,%20was%20written%20by%20BarkingBird,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:08%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20think%20an%20important%20point%20about%20this%20issue%20that%20has%20been%20overlooked%20is%20the%20class%20angle.%20The%20disgusthttp://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896778#comment-896778http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896778#comment-896778http://crregistervote%28%27896742%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896742,%20was%20written%20by%20MrPikeBishop,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%206:49%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Aw%20Cif%20you%20dissapoint%20me...%20surely%20a%20cracking%20headline%20was%20waiting%20hereNo%20noose%20is%20good%20news...%20ethttp://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896742#comment-896742http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896742#comment-896742http://crregistervote%28%27896720%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896720,%20was%20written%20by%20halgeel84,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%206:34%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20--Lionel%20McPherson%20Peace%20to%20you.%20I%20would%20like%20to%20point%20ou%20that%60American%20whites,%20which%20I%20suppose%20yo


5/41

Recommend?

TheEarlofSuave

Comment No.896789

October 30 19:16

GBR

I think nooses hanging around are quite terrifying. However, let's not blow things out of proportion. There are

hardly any racists to march against anymore. Surely it's better to treat it as a serious crime, then engage in the

theatrics of marches and all the other hubub. I mean what's worse, people killing people, or a noose on a tree. I

think black people have more to worry about, such as the *deadly* crime in their own neighbourhoods that people

tend to accept.


GreenLake

Comment No.896794

October 30 19:20

USA

halgeel84:

"I would like to point ou that`American whites, which I suppose you do mean the middle and upper class

Americans, hate the poor, no matter of the colour of their skin."

This kind of obscene generalisation is deemed perfectly acceptable, I presume, because it maligns Americans

rather than any other race in the world. Disgusting.


Klashnekoff

Comment No.896796

October 30 19:20

"The joke presumably works like this: You can't lynch black folks these days, but you probably can get away with

aggressively tweaking their tender sensibilities. Not amused? Oh well - lighten up, or appreciate the burdens of

living in a free society."

Could not have put it better myself?
http://crregistervote%28%27896778%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896778%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896789#comment-896789http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896789#comment-896789http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896789#comment-896789http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896789#comment-896789http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896789#comment-896789mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896789,%20was%20written%20by%20TheEarlofSuave,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:16%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20think%20nooses%20hanging%20around%20are%20quite%20terrifying.%20%20However,%20let%27s%20not%20blow%20things%20out%20of%20proportiomailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896789,%20was%20written%20by%20TheEarlofSuave,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:16%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20think%20nooses%20hanging%20around%20are%20quite%20terrifying.%20%20However,%20let%27s%20not%20blow%20things%20out%20of%20proportiomailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896789,%20was%20written%20by%20TheEarlofSuave,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:16%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20think%20nooses%20hanging%20around%20are%20quite%20terrifying.%20%20However,%20let%27s%20not%20blow%20things%20out%20of%20proportiohttp://crregistervote%28%27896789%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896789%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896794#comment-896794http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896794#comment-896794http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896794#comment-896794http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896794#comment-896794http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896794#comment-896794mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896794,%20was%20written%20by%20GreenLake,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:20%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20halgeel84:%22I%20would%20like%20to%20point%20ou%20that%60American%20whites,%20which%20I%20suppose%20you%20do%20mean%20the%20middle%20amailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896794,%20was%20written%20by%20GreenLake,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:20%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20halgeel84:%22I%20would%20like%20to%20point%20ou%20that%60American%20whites,%20which%20I%20suppose%20you%20do%20mean%20the%20middle%20amailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896794,%20was%20written%20by%20GreenLake,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:20%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20halgeel84:%22I%20would%20like%20to%20point%20ou%20that%60American%20whites,%20which%20I%20suppose%20you%20do%20mean%20the%20middle%20ahttp://crregistervote%28%27896794%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896794%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896796#comment-896796http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896796#comment-896796http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896796#comment-896796http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896796#comment-896796http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896796#comment-896796http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896796#comment-896796http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896796#comment-896796http://crregistervote%28%27896794%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896794,%20was%20written%20by%20GreenLake,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:20%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20halgeel84:%22I%20would%20like%20to%20point%20ou%20that%60American%20whites,%20which%20I%20suppose%20you%20do%20mean%20the%20middle%20ahttp://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896794#comment-896794http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896794#comment-896794http://crregistervote%28%27896789%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896789,%20was%20written%20by%20TheEarlofSuave,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:16%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20think%20nooses%20hanging%20around%20are%20quite%20terrifying.%20%20However,%20let%27s%20not%20blow%20things%20out%20of%20proportiohttp://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896789#comment-896789http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896789#comment-896789http://crregistervote%28%27896778%27%29/


6/41

It is precisely these mechanics that are in operation today in the UK concerning ethnic minorities, their systematic

denigration within the context of a faux political correctness / immigration debate on limits to free speech in liberal

democracies all whilst clearly supporting a dangerous far right agenda.


halgeel84

Comment No.896816

October 30 19:36

CAN

---GreenLake

I will not return your insulting terms but indeed the literature is think on how American middle and upper classes

hate the poor.

Evidenc: why all the all the talk of progressivistic discourse there is no universal healthcare and unversal education

in the US.

here is a good title for you to read.

'White Trash: Race and Class in America' eds. Matt Wray and Annalee Newitz (1997} Routledge

Thus according to the editors of this collection [supported by evidence] " Americans love to hate the poor. Lately, it

seems there is no group of poor folks they hate more than than white trash' (p.1).

And yes, these black Americans are now working for the US corporare/military imperial complex in the recolonising

project of Africa.

Thus your insults misplaced.


RichardAdams

Comment No.896819

October 30 19:39

MrPikeBishop - "Cif you dissapoint me... surely a cracking headline was waiting here."

MPB, we did consider a few alternatives, but none could beat this magnificent example in poor taste from the awful

Management Today magazine:
mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896796,%20was%20written%20by%20Klashnekoff,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:20%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20%22The%20joke%20presumably%20works%20like%20this:%20You%20can%27t%20lynch%20black%20folks%20these%20days,%20but%20you%20probably%20can%20gmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896796,%20was%20written%20by%20Klashnekoff,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:20%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20%22The%20joke%20presumably%20works%20like%20this:%20You%20can%27t%20lynch%20black%20folks%20these%20days,%20but%20you%20probably%20can%20gmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896796,%20was%20written%20by%20Klashnekoff,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:20%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20%22The%20joke%20presumably%20works%20like%20this:%20You%20can%27t%20lynch%20black%20folks%20these%20days,%20but%20you%20probably%20can%20ghttp://crregistervote%28%27896796%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896796%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896816#comment-896816http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896816#comment-896816http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896816#comment-896816http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896816#comment-896816http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896816#comment-896816mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896816,%20was%20written%20by%20halgeel84,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:36%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20---GreenLake%20I%20will%20not%20return%20your%20insulting%20terms%20but%20indeed%20the%20literature%20is%20think%20on%20how%20Amermailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896816,%20was%20written%20by%20halgeel84,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:36%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20---GreenLake%20I%20will%20not%20return%20your%20insulting%20terms%20but%20indeed%20the%20literature%20is%20think%20on%20how%20Amermailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896816,%20was%20written%20by%20halgeel84,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:36%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20---GreenLake%20I%20will%20not%20return%20your%20insulting%20terms%20but%20indeed%20the%20literature%20is%20think%20on%20how%20Amerhttp://crregistervote%28%27896816%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896816%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896819#comment-896819http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896819#comment-896819http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896819#comment-896819http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896819#comment-896819http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896819#comment-896819http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896819#comment-896819http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896819#comment-896819http://crregistervote%28%27896816%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896816,%20was%20written%20by%20halgeel84,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:36%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20---GreenLake%20I%20will%20not%20return%20your%20insulting%20terms%20but%20indeed%20the%20literature%20is%20think%20on%20how%20Amerhttp://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896816#comment-896816http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896816#comment-896816http://crregistervote%28%27896796%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896796,%20was%20written%20by%20Klashnekoff,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:20%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20%22The%20joke%20presumably%20works%20like%20this:%20You%20can%27t%20lynch%20black%20folks%20these%20days,%20but%20you%20probably%20can%20g


7/41

http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/usa/2007/10/wall_street_blues.html


GreenLake

Comment No.896842

October 30 19:54

USA

halgeel84:

You have a strange grasp of what constitutes an "insult". You'll notice, on reflection, that I said nothing about you

personally - I don't not know you - but commented only on the ugly, sweeping generalisation you made.

On the other hand, your comment, to the effect that all middle and upper class Americans, without qualification or

exception, hate poor people is a grave insult to many of the people I love most in the world and some of the finest

human beings I've ever met.

I expect some Americans hate poor people - although i suspect they're more liekly to be contemptuous of them,

ambivalent about tham or just not give a damn one way or another about them. Others, though, love and care for

and about them, work with and for them, champion their cause and make tremendous sacrifices on their behalf.

Fine, decent and loving people exist in all nations, in all classes and all walks of life. It is depressing that such asimple and obvious truth needs to be spelled out on these pages.


ToothlessHooligan

Comment No.896851

October 30 20:01

USA

Deleted by Cif moderator. Other posts repeating this post have also been deleted.


bannedbycastro

Comment No.896855
http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/usa/2007/10/wall_street_blues.htmlhttp://blogs.guardian.co.uk/usa/2007/10/wall_street_blues.htmlmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896819,%20was%20written%20by%20RichardAdams,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:39%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20MrPikeBishop%20-%20%22Cif%20you%20dissapoint%20me...%20surely%20a%20cracking%20headline%20was%20waiting%20here.%22MPB,%20we%20did%20mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896819,%20was%20written%20by%20RichardAdams,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:39%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20MrPikeBishop%20-%20%22Cif%20you%20dissapoint%20me...%20surely%20a%20cracking%20headline%20was%20waiting%20here.%22MPB,%20we%20did%20mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896819,%20was%20written%20by%20RichardAdams,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:39%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20MrPikeBishop%20-%20%22Cif%20you%20dissapoint%20me...%20surely%20a%20cracking%20headline%20was%20waiting%20here.%22MPB,%20we%20did%20http://crregistervote%28%27896819%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896819%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896842#comment-896842http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896842#comment-896842http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896842#comment-896842http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896842#comment-896842http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896842#comment-896842mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896842,%20was%20written%20by%20GreenLake,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:54%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20halgeel84:You%20have%20a%20strange%20grasp%20of%20what%20constitutes%20an%20%22insult%22.%20%20You%27ll%20notice,%20on%20reflection,mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896842,%20was%20written%20by%20GreenLake,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:54%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20halgeel84:You%20have%20a%20strange%20grasp%20of%20what%20constitutes%20an%20%22insult%22.%20%20You%27ll%20notice,%20on%20reflection,mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896842,%20was%20written%20by%20GreenLake,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:54%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20halgeel84:You%20have%20a%20strange%20grasp%20of%20what%20constitutes%20an%20%22insult%22.%20%20You%27ll%20notice,%20on%20reflection,http://crregistervote%28%27896842%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896842%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896851#comment-896851http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896851#comment-896851http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896851#comment-896851http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896851#comment-896851http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896851#comment-896851mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896851,%20was%20written%20by%20ToothlessHooligan,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:01%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Deleted%20by%20Cif%20moderator.%20Other%20posts%20repeating%20this%20post%20have%20also%20been%20deleted.mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896851,%20was%20written%20by%20ToothlessHooligan,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:01%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Deleted%20by%20Cif%20moderator.%20Other%20posts%20repeating%20this%20post%20have%20also%20been%20deleted.mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896851,%20was%20written%20by%20ToothlessHooligan,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:01%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Deleted%20by%20Cif%20moderator.%20Other%20posts%20repeating%20this%20post%20have%20also%20been%20deleted.http://crregistervote%28%27896851%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896851%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896855#comment-896855http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896855#comment-896855http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896855#comment-896855http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896855#comment-896855http://crregistervote%28%27896851%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896851,%20was%20written%20by%20ToothlessHooligan,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:01%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Deleted%20by%20Cif%20moderator.%20Other%20posts%20repeating%20this%20post%20have%20also%20been%20deleted.http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896851#comment-896851http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896851#comment-896851http://crregistervote%28%27896842%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896842,%20was%20written%20by%20GreenLake,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:54%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20halgeel84:You%20have%20a%20strange%20grasp%20of%20what%20constitutes%20an%20%22insult%22.%20%20You%27ll%20notice,%20on%20reflection,http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896842#comment-896842http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896842#comment-896842http://crregistervote%28%27896819%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896819,%20was%20written%20by%20RichardAdams,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%207:39%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20MrPikeBishop%20-%20%22Cif%20you%20dissapoint%20me...%20surely%20a%20cracking%20headline%20was%20waiting%20here.%22MPB,%20we%20did%20http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/usa/2007/10/wall_street_blues.html


8/41

October 30 20:03

USA

I hope the author supports Hate crime legislation and in doing so he will be glad that it is applied to the case where

six people of one race, attack an innocent member of anther race; because of the victims race.

Looks like an open-and-shut case to me. If you wish to punish racial attacks the law should apply to six black guys

kicking the crap out of a white guy, jast as you would if six wite guys kicked the crap out of a black guy.

I look forward to your reply.


arg907149

Comment No.896874

October 30 20:15

USA

In response to Halgeel84, I think you're close to the target when you say that better-off Americans hate the poor,

but I think it is more fear than hatred. Hatred and fear are very close emotions.

I'm white and grew up in North Carolina. My family was very poor. I was beaten every day that I went to school.

Not by black folks, but by the better off white kids who lived in town. Who knows why I was the target? Maybe

because I simply looked poor, and people fear poverty and don't want it near them.

best, arg


Generic109

Comment No.896881

October 30 20:18

USA

bannedbycastro,

Please look further into the matter before commenting. The Jena incident was about equal protection under the

law. Read further. You'll change your mind.
http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896855#comment-896855http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896855#comment-896855mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896855,%20was%20written%20by%20bannedbycastro,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:03%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20hope%20the%20author%20supports%20Hate%20crime%20legislation%20and%20in%20doing%20so%20he%20will%20be%20glad%20that%20it%20is%20appliedmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896855,%20was%20written%20by%20bannedbycastro,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:03%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20hope%20the%20author%20supports%20Hate%20crime%20legislation%20and%20in%20doing%20so%20he%20will%20be%20glad%20that%20it%20is%20appliedmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896855,%20was%20written%20by%20bannedbycastro,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:03%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20hope%20the%20author%20supports%20Hate%20crime%20legislation%20and%20in%20doing%20so%20he%20will%20be%20glad%20that%20it%20is%20appliedhttp://crregistervote%28%27896855%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896855%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896874#comment-896874http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896874#comment-896874http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896874#comment-896874http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896874#comment-896874http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896874#comment-896874mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896874,%20was%20written%20by%20arg907149,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:15%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20In%20response%20to%20Halgeel84,%20I%20think%20you%27re%20close%20to%20the%20target%20when%20you%20say%20that%20better-off%20Americans%20mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896874,%20was%20written%20by%20arg907149,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:15%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20In%20response%20to%20Halgeel84,%20I%20think%20you%27re%20close%20to%20the%20target%20when%20you%20say%20that%20better-off%20Americans%20mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896874,%20was%20written%20by%20arg907149,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:15%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20In%20response%20to%20Halgeel84,%20I%20think%20you%27re%20close%20to%20the%20target%20when%20you%20say%20that%20better-off%20Americans%20http://crregistervote%28%27896874%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896874%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896881#comment-896881http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896881#comment-896881http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896881#comment-896881http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896881#comment-896881http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896881#comment-896881http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896881#comment-896881http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896881#comment-896881http://crregistervote%28%27896874%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896874,%20was%20written%20by%20arg907149,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:15%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20In%20response%20to%20Halgeel84,%20I%20think%20you%27re%20close%20to%20the%20target%20when%20you%20say%20that%20better-off%20Americans%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896874#comment-896874http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896874#comment-896874http://crregistervote%28%27896855%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896855,%20was%20written%20by%20bannedbycastro,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:03%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20I%20hope%20the%20author%20supports%20Hate%20crime%20legislation%20and%20in%20doing%20so%20he%20will%20be%20glad%20that%20it%20is%20appliedhttp://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896855#comment-896855


9/41

Halgeel, I have to disagree with you. In some places, such as the south, race trumps everything. Poor whites hate

blacks as well. Race and class always have to be looked at together, but they have their own separate

explanations.


ComicalSpook

Comment No.896898

October 30 20:32

GBR

Let me tell you something - people always go on about integration and social cohesion and all this crap, but in my

experience, the problem is 'white flight' - you look at any area where there is a high proportion of ethnic minorities

and you will find every race under the sun living perfectly happily with each other, but noticeably the whites have

moved out - whether that's to do with them not wanting to live in a poor area or not wanting to live in a ghetto,

you tell me.


JohnLilburne

Comment No.896900

October 30 20:33

USA

A widespread response among Americans is to point to those cases of nooses and other threats that have turned

out to be fakes. This outbreak of reported cases is dismissed as a fad rather as evidence that people, both black

and white, have been emboldened to complain.

In fact, if one looks at legal cases concerning hostile work environments, nooses seem startlingly common.

Management always tries to claim that it had no idea that nooses were perceived as hostile. Such cases are so

difficult and stressful to bring, that we may assume there is a large unseen iceberg. Although there may be some

copycat cases, one good result of this publicity is that claims of ignorance can no longer be made.

Although the point about racism continuing to lurk in many social environments is well taken, it is nevertheless the

case that life is harder for any visible minority in small communities, where there is far less diversity. Stereotypical

assumptions can be startlingly naked in towns where there is no substantial black middle class.

However, the position of many Hispanic Americans, even if legal immigrants or established in the US for

generations, can be at least as bad, depending on the region. They are not only assumed to be ill-educated

criminals, but they are believed to be stealing jobs and breeding too rapidly so that they threaten English-speaking
mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896881,%20was%20written%20by%20Generic109,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:18%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20bannedbycastro,Please%20look%20further%20into%20the%20matter%20before%20commenting.%20The%20Jena%20incident%20was%20about%20emailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896881,%20was%20written%20by%20Generic109,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:18%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20bannedbycastro,Please%20look%20further%20into%20the%20matter%20before%20commenting.%20The%20Jena%20incident%20was%20about%20emailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896881,%20was%20written%20by%20Generic109,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:18%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20bannedbycastro,Please%20look%20further%20into%20the%20matter%20before%20commenting.%20The%20Jena%20incident%20was%20about%20ehttp://crregistervote%28%27896881%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896881%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896898#comment-896898http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896898#comment-896898http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896898#comment-896898http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896898#comment-896898http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896898#comment-896898mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896898,%20was%20written%20by%20ComicalSpook,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:32%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Let%20me%20tell%20you%20something%20-%20people%20always%20go%20on%20about%20integration%20and%20social%20cohesion%20and%20all%20this%20cmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896898,%20was%20written%20by%20ComicalSpook,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:32%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Let%20me%20tell%20you%20something%20-%20people%20always%20go%20on%20about%20integration%20and%20social%20cohesion%20and%20all%20this%20cmailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896898,%20was%20written%20by%20ComicalSpook,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:32%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Let%20me%20tell%20you%20something%20-%20people%20always%20go%20on%20about%20integration%20and%20social%20cohesion%20and%20all%20this%20chttp://crregistervote%28%27896898%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896898%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896900#comment-896900http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896900#comment-896900http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896900#comment-896900http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896900#comment-896900http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896900#comment-896900http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896900#comment-896900http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896900#comment-896900http://crregistervote%28%27896898%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896898,%20was%20written%20by%20ComicalSpook,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:32%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Let%20me%20tell%20you%20something%20-%20people%20always%20go%20on%20about%20integration%20and%20social%20cohesion%20and%20all%20this%20chttp://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896898#comment-896898http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896898#comment-896898http://crregistervote%28%27896881%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896881,%20was%20written%20by%20Generic109,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:18%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20bannedbycastro,Please%20look%20further%20into%20the%20matter%20before%20commenting.%20The%20Jena%20incident%20was%20about%20e


10/41

Protestant culture. Such prejudices are to be found even in the work of respectable academics in major

universities.

The extent to which conservative opinion denies the continuing influence of socio-economic disadvantage and

prejudice is extraordinary. Many conservatives claim that racism survives only among liberals and ethnic

minorities. The Bush administration censored half of a report on racism within the Department of Justice, cut

references to disadvantange and inequality from a Department of Health and Human Affairs report on healthcare

gaps, and most recently cut out discussion of the disproportionate effect on the health of ethnic minorities that

climate change will cause, from the report of the Director of the CDC.

In part, this reflects the longstanding American refusal to consider the possibility that widespread social

phenomena are brought about by social causes rather than just individual choices. However, it also reflects a

rejection of the social interventionism of LBJ's Great Society, FDR's New Deal, and even the regulation of big

business of the Progressive Era. Opposition to environmentalism and international organizations is part and parcel

of this.

Consequently, the lack of educational opportunities in the inner city cannot be acknowledged as proceeding from

either white flight or the inter-generational effect of the economic distance put between black and white Americans

brought about by the heavily biased administration of the GI Bill and by the Jim Crow laws. The heavy pollution of

areas occupied by ethnic minorities cannot be acknowledged to have any connection with the biased exemptions

from environmental controls provided to corporate campaign donors by politicians such as the former Governor of

Texas.

The largely unexamined category of whiteness remains the basis for American identity and the privileges that

accrue from full status, even if it has been extended to include European Catholics and Jews. Some affluent or

conservative black Americans and Hispanic Americans have been granted the status of "honorary whites", but the

promise of social coherence that broke out after 9/11 now seems only a flash in the pan.

Of course there are many poor whites who have been left out by the absence of social provision and by the failure

to use parental poverty as a category for affirmative action. However, a single generation of higher education will

suffice for their descendants to escape prejudice. Their lack of full American status is not written on their faces.

The educated or newly affluent children of poor whites are not going to be made the target of racial profiling every

time they buy a new car, even by black police officers. They will not be assumed to have gained access to a good

university only because they got a sports scholarship. They will not be instant suspects when they shop in a

department store, even for black store detectives. Extra hurdles will not be placed in their way every time they try

to take out a loan, even if the bank manager is black. They will not be refused a job interview just because their

given name indicates that they are members of an ethnic minority.

All of the above obstacles have been well documented in the case of black Americans. Most white Americans are

absolutely unaware of these phenomena, even if they are participating in them.


11/41


bannedbycastro

Comment No.896904

October 30 20:36

USA

Deleted by Cif moderator


europeanstudent

Comment No.896923

October 30 20:50

NLD

@Lionel McPherson

Saddening.

It reminds me of an little incident in my own life last year. I was following a course (part of an MA-programme in

English Literature) on James Joyce's works, and some of the students in this course were also enrolled in another

course on some novels by William Faulkner. At one point during a discussion some of the other Dutch students, the

professor and I started discussing - mind you, in an academic setting, and not on the street - the usages of and

controversies surrounding the word 'nigger'. We weren't hurling the word at anyone. We were in the Netherlands,

and we were discussing the word 'nigger' as we would discuss the word 'Untermensch' in the context of a course on

the Third Reich.

Suddenly, this American student started attacking us for the simple fact of having uttered the word 'nigger'. I tried

to tell her that I felt that if we were to stop discussing the (different) usages of such words in history, culture,

literature and politics - and in the history of literature, culture and politics - we would be fooling ourselves: you'll

end up erasing the memory of the Ku Klux Klan, and the entire history and the context from which the most

hateful use of the word 'nigger' emerged. I pointed out that, for example, in the USSR it was very normal to erase

the images of people who had fallen out of favour with Stalin or other Party Big Shots from the history books. How

convenient it seems for some people to stop talking about the most painful issues surrounding the word 'nigger'!

Certainly, these Dutch students and I would also have discussed the history of Dutch colonialism and the slave

trade, etc, on another moment, - and I certainly have done that - but we were having a discussion in the context of

a course on Literature written by means of the ENGLISH language.
mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896900,%20was%20written%20by%20JohnLilburne,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:33%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20A%20widespread%20response%20among%20Americans%20is%20to%20point%20to%20those%20cases%20of%20nooses%20and%20other%20threats%20that%20hamailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896900,%20was%20written%20by%20JohnLilburne,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:33%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20A%20widespread%20response%20among%20Americans%20is%20to%20point%20to%20those%20cases%20of%20nooses%20and%20other%20threats%20that%20hamailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896900,%20was%20written%20by%20JohnLilburne,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:33%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20A%20widespread%20response%20among%20Americans%20is%20to%20point%20to%20those%20cases%20of%20nooses%20and%20other%20threats%20that%20hahttp://crregistervote%28%27896900%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896900%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896904#comment-896904http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896904#comment-896904http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896904#comment-896904http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896904#comment-896904http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896904#comment-896904mailto:[email 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protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896904,%20was%20written%20by%20bannedbycastro,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:36%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Deleted%20by%20Cif%20moderatorhttp://crregistervote%28%27896904%27%29/http://crregistervote%28%27896904%27%29/http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896923#comment-896923http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896923#comment-896923http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896923#comment-896923http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896923#comment-896923http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896923#comment-896923http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896923#comment-896923http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896923#comment-896923http://crregistervote%28%27896904%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896904,%20was%20written%20by%20bannedbycastro,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:36%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20Deleted%20by%20Cif%20moderatorhttp://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896904#comment-896904http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html#comment-896904#comment-896904http://crregistervote%28%27896900%27%29/mailto:[email protected]?subject=A%20problem%20with%20http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/lionel_mcpherson/2007/10/americas_race_obsession.html&body=Please%20tell%20us%20the%20problem.%20For%20our%20reference,%20internally%20this%20comment%20is%20known%20as%20Number%20896900,%20was%20written%20by%20JohnLilburne,%20%20at%20October%2030,%202007%20%208:33%20PM,%20and%20starts%20with%20A%20widespread%20response%20among%20Americans%20is%20to%20point%20to%20those%20cases%20of%20nooses%20and%20other%20threats%20that%20ha


12/41

The strange thing was that this young American woman assumed, completely out of the blue, that we Dutch

students were all some kind of pro-Apartheid nazi Aryan fanatics simply because we were DUTCH students trying

to figure out what's up with all the different sides to the 'n-word'-controversy. The young lady was from New York.

With regard to the incarceration rates of African Americans, the state of New York is one of the worst in the USA,

which I mentioned to her..in vain. I tried to confront her at a later stage with her unwillingness to discuss the

horrible treatment of a large percentage of African-Americans in present-day USA, but she did not wish to react.

Then I tried to confront her with the way it struck me as rather odd that she was so passionate when it came to

trying to censor ANY kind of discussion of the historical use of the word 'nigger', while simultaneously she was

unwilling to engage in a discussion about the present-day injustices in American society.

I refrain from calling the young American lady 'White'. I am myself a white-looking, Portuguese-Dutch person, yet

my mother and all of the family from my mother's side look quite Mediterranean, North-African, sometimes they

look like 'typical' Arabs, and two aunts of mine have Black African-type hair. Both my parents are Portuguese, and

my father is of Germanic, Celtic, Latin and Sephardic Jewish descent.

'Whiteness' and 'Blac

americas race obsession

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